New to Saltwater in Roundrock

[FloridaBoy]

Hello Everyone,

After keeping freshwater tanks for over 20 years, I've finally decided to start a saltwater tank. I've had ciclids, planted tanks, gars, and lastly a breeding pair of Angel Fish. Sadly, after 7 years, the angel fish passed away, and while taking advantage of an empty tank to perform a deep clean, I had the crazy idea that this was the perfect time to "take the plunge" and jump into saltwater. (The tank is a 24 gallon JBJ Nanocube I had originally bought for a freshwater planted tank, with the idea that I could easily convert to saltwater at a later date.)

Thinking it should be pretty straightforward, I started visiting the LFC's to begin setting up the tank, and PROMPTLY LOST MY MIND! Every single one had radically different ideas on what substrate, live rock, salinity, etc to use. Which would have been fine if any of them could answer a question factually. And the various websites I visited were just as bad. I almost gave up on the whole idea until i found this site. So, I'm hoping that your collective knowledge can help me!

I'll be starting a Tank Build thread and eagerly anticipate your advice and help Thanks to everyone in advance - Steve

[victoly]

Welcome steve! Yes there are many ways. Start with what you want to keep and select your hardware based off of the inhabitants.

[mFrame]

Welcome Steve, glad you found the club. Before your build thread you might want to talk about what you want to have in your tank, it will help with all the advice you're sure to get.

Oh, and put our October Meeting and Frag Swap on your calendar, it's a great chance to meet people and discuss your ideas as well as to see RichardL's fantastic setup!

[Richard L]

Welcome Steve! I remember those exact same sentiments. Too many variables and conflicting information flying around to make heads or tails of it when you're starting out. I've run planted freshwater tanks though, and I can tell you that I've found saltwater is much easier. I don't know if it really is easier or if its I really enjoy taking care of them more than fresh. The best advice I can give you is to go slow, find someone's tank you like and try to replicate what they are doing (livestock, equipment, husbandry) and most importantly ignore anything Victoly says - its got me thru so far. I'm just kidding, go as fast as you like. Hope you can make it out to the swap. - Richard

btw, thanks Mike for the kind words!

[FloridaBoy]

Welcome Steve, glad you found the club. Before your build thread you might want to talk about what you want to have in your tank, it will help with all the advice you're sure to get.

Oh, and put our October Meeting and Frag Swap on your calendar, it's a great chance to meet people and discuss your ideas as well as to see RichardL's fantastic setup!

Hi Mike,

Good point. Right now I'm focused on setting up the most stable tank environment, then figuring out what will thrive in my tank. From my research so far, it seems pretty universally accepted that the smaller the marine aquarium, the less stable. Ultimately, I would like to create as diverse an ecosystem as my little tank can handle, heavy on the corals and inverts. So right now I'm trying to go slow and build the tank from ground up while I learn. However, I seem stuck in first gear just trying to decide on what type / where to get the best live rock: Fiji, Florida aquacultured, manufactured (real reef), and what type of substrate: none, sand, "live" aragonite sand, crushed coral.

The first LFS I went to suggested the aragonite sand with some real reef live rock would work well in my tank. So I put 20 lbs of the "live sand" and 9 pounds of the "live" rock in the tank just to start the tank cycling while I did more research. I'm not married to any of it. That's been running fine for 4 weeks now with a few hermit crabs. Right now I'm leaning on getting some aquacultured Florida live rock for the color and microfauna diversity. Any thoughts?

Steve

[Planeden]

welcome to the site and good luck. there is a lot of good advice on here. for florida live rock, check aquaculture ranch here is austin (and on the forums).

[Sascha D.]

Welcome and good luck!

There are quite a few from RR on this site. If I could give someone first starting out any kind of advice it would be this:

• Plan ahead! Thinking about what kind of equipment and livestock you want now will save you a lot of money and frustration later.
• If you can, always have a drilled tank. My first tank had a hang on the back overflow and once I upgraded, I never looked back.
• If you're building your own sump, do your homework and plan for anything you might want in there before installing baffles. Nothing is more frustrating than shopping for a skimmer and find out that your options are limited because of your compartment size.
• Even if you don't install a water filter in your house, a 55g barrel will save you time and effort mixing water and topping off the tank.

[ckyuv]

For rock if your looking for diversity and color I would also recommend aquaculture ranch. Patrick is a rock nerd and does a great job with his rock! It's a little bit of a drive from round rock but what you loose in gas he makes up for in hospitality! Welcome to the club there is a lot of very smart people on here!

[subsea]

Welcome steve! Yes there are many ways. Start with what you want to keep and select your hardware based off of the inhabitants.

This is the most important aspect of a long term, successful tank. Design the tank around a biotheme or a pivital species. In John Tullocks book "The Natural Reef Aquarium" he clarified how everything fits together around having compatible companions. Depending on which biotheme you pick, determines equipment, cost and husbandry requirements. I like macro lagoons for low cost and simplicity of maintenance.

Patrick

[FloridaBoy]

I want to thank everyone for your warm welcome and very helpful and insightful advice. This has made me excited to set up the tank again! I have to admit, before I found this site I was ready to tear it all down and box it up in the attic for a few years. I will definitely be making a trip to the aquaculture ranch to check out the rocks and tanks, and I look forward to attending the upcoming meeting.

Cheers! Steve

[Neon Reefer]

So Steve

I really like the JBJ series for the look and ease of running the tank. Yes they are small so water quality can change in a heartbeat, I have had 2 JBJs until recently. The only problem I ever had was heat issues, so if you have the 50 /50 PC model w/ 2 36 watt bulbs you already know about the heat problems and this will cause you more issues w/ sensitive santwater inhabitants.

If you are utilizing the the LED model w/ 15 x 1.3 watts then heat is not nearly as big of issue. In addition there is ~420 PAR @ 2" deep on this tank making it a better choice for SPS type corals. The CF model falls below this mark considerably and is more limiting to LPS and Soft corals.

Both have 290 GPH for out of the box flow which is pretty nice for filtration. I would add 2 JBJ powerheads on a wave maker for $80 and you have your total flow @ 790 GPH or ~30 times which is all you'd ever need.

As far as keeping good water quality in the smaller tanks then its is all about the substrate and rock. For superior water stability i would suggust 30 lbs or good quality live rock and only 1" of substrate of choice. Sand beds deeper than this IMHO are problamatic in smaller tanks. I do have 20lbs of artificial rock in my current tank and do not like it as much as my Toga deep water rock. I would suggust Tonga over Pukanti which is notorious for having PO4 issues.

I would do weekly water changes to = 10% w/ a high quality reef salt of your choice mixed w/ RODI. (River City aquatics @ 20 cents per gallon). Don't skimp here either. This will help keep up your water foundation elements and trace. Be sure you test weekly to determine if you have good numbers, and pay close attention to your Alkilinity. I like Red Sea Pro for foundation and NO3 and PO4.

At the point you are at now I would buy additional rock and cure and cycle it in an icechest prior to placing in tank, and I would remove ~ 10 lbs of the sand down to 1" to prevent future algae issues. Then let all that settle down for a couple of months While you map out your stocking list. You will only be able to successfully keep about 4 small fish in that tank w/ live coral. Or two medium size fish like a pair of clowns. Any more and you are going to have Nitrate NO3 and Phosphate PO4 issues which your coral will not like..

As far as corals I like the LPS fleshy corals. Acans are colorful and hearty as are open and closed brains. I stay away from the longer tenticle corals IE hammers, elegance, torch ect... as they will require too much room for a smaller tank. As far as SPS I would try some of the various Monti's up near the top and stay away from the branching SPS like birdsnest.

Good luck and be sure to ask lots of questions..

[FloridaBoy]

So Steve...

Good luck and be sure to ask lots of questions..

Thanks! - I have more questions Also, I really appreciate the time you put into your very thorough and extremely helpful response.

I have the 50/50 PC model, and yes, it does put out a little heat. Thankfully I keep the house cold, so the tank is staying at ~76F at the moment. However, if all goes well I’m thinking of upgrading to the LED lid next year, or beefing up the exhaust fans. I’ve also noticed that leaving the “feeding” lid open helps. Any other suggestions?

Question – what did you do with the back “filter” area of the tank. The LFS that sold me the initial sand / rock said to take everything out of the back (which I did), but it seems a waste to not use all that space. I was thinking of adding some rubble and / or a light to make a mini 'fuge.

Thanks again – Steve

[victoly]

You could stick a tunze 9002 skimmer back there. mount your autotopoff, secondary pumps for reactors, etc. youll find a way to fill it rapidly.

[subsea]

Yes to rubble in the back compartment. IMO the light is not necessary. Biofilm will grow on the rock with out the light. Leave room for activated carbon.

Patrick

[FloridaBoy]

Yes to rubble in the back compartment. IMO the light is not necessary. Biofilm will grow on the rock with out the light. Leave room for activated carbon.

Patrick

Cool - left you a PM.

Steve

[FloridaBoy]

Hi Everyone! I wanted to post an update on my progress. I've been slowly but steadily adding goodies to the tank. I went to visit Patrick last weekend, and
I must say that I was extremely impressed by both the quality of his rock / macro-algae and his hospitality! The colors and variety of life on his rock is
outstanding. The down side to this is I keep rearranging the rocks when I find new cool things on them

Nota Bene - I've found 5 nickel to quarter sized clams so far, and they keep the water crystal clean.

The tank as of today: (24 gallon JBJ Nanocube, stock w/ two 36W 50/50 powercompact bulbs)

~30 lbs of Live Rock

~10 Blue Leg Hermits

~4 snails (need more)

Red and Green Macro-Algae (assorted)

2 juvenile Clowns

1 Heteroxenia

Pic Below:

[Neon Reefer]

Does the 24 Gal have the knock outs on the back panel? My 12 gal does and I beleive the 24 is built exactly like the 12 just bigger... Look for one on either side of the back lid, should be there for the addition plugs, lines ect... I have both mine knocked out to help keep the heat down a bit.

Tank looks awesome. have fun!

[Planeden]

that looks really nice. i like all the macro.

[FloridaBoy]

OK - really noob question: Bought some frags at the meeting yesterday. (I was the guy in cargo shorts and tacky Hawiian shirt. Hey, I'm a native Floridian - I like to embrace the stereotype!) So.... How do you attach your frags to your live rock? Do you take the rock out and drill holes in it, or will the corals come off the frag structure, or does the peg break off?

On the plus side, all the frags are settling in well to the tank. (Thanks Richard and Sherita)

[subsea]

Your full tank shot looks very nice. Your aqua scaping is balanced nicely. The contrasting texture and color is a god mix.

One last comment on the lights. A change to LED will not necessary enhance your lighting. Your present lighting is full spectrum. At 2.5 Watts per gallon you should be pushing between 50-100 PAR. Over the years, I have found lower lighting intensities to be beneficial toward long term system health. If you are not having heat problems, I would change nothing on your lights.

l

[Robb in Austin]

Welcome!

You might consider starting a build thread to get a broader range of responses. Many folks won't look in the welcome section once they state some initial hellos.

[Planeden]

really noob answer,

i think either option you listed are done. the drilling always seemed like a pain to me. presonally, so far i have just been setting the plug in a crvice and super glue it in place.

one thing i would conisder, is the the corals may not be happy where you first decide to put them, or you may look at the tank for a while and decide you'd like to shift it a little. i would try my best to cram the corals somewhere, prop? balance? wedge? not sure the word, but put them in a temporary place that is close to where you want it and watch it for a while. see if it is extending, coloring up, fadng, or melting. and see if you do like the way it looks after looking at it over time. it's easier to shift about before you go to permanent mounting measures.

my first set of corals sat in their temporary spots for about a month. they all finally ended up in different locations. i still haven't glued down my large teather coral becaiuse i know it is going to get rather large. i need to put it in a place i like (and it likes) that wont overgrow and shade other corals i get. this will probably be the "last" coral i glue in place.

depending on the corals you will also need to learn about acclimating them. i think this is mostly with SPS tanks with high lighting. but the idea is basically to put corals low and then slowly raise them towards the top to acclimate them towards the ultra bright lighting. people have posted extensively about this process, so you may want to look for that. of course, with your first batch of corals you can just reduce the lighting and slowy increase it.

hope this helps a little. people seem to like correcting me, so maybe it will also get others to weigh in . also, i agree with robb. start a build thread and it will get more answers.