Question about filter blocks.... probably noob question...

[+FluxCapacitor]

I've noticed that my water flow is hindered by the filtration block filling up with junk and this affects the skimming on my tank. This is pretty apparent when I pull the block out to clean it and the ATO immediately comes on and puts some water in the tank. Is there any "good" way around this that also allows good mechanical filtration or do I just need to clean the filter block more regularly. I usually clean it when I notice the skimmer isn't doing it's work as much as it does normally. Please don't think I'm being neglectful because I do monitor this daily but it's definitely a noticeable thing and the ATO isn't putting so much water in the tank that I think it's swinging the salinity in an unsafe manner.

Today I noticed the return pump area on my sump in the 34G was pretty low on water despite the rest of the system being "normal". The flow coming out of the return pump was definitely weaker than normal too. I"m going to check it out more tomorrow in the day time but I just wanted to ask if this was something that other people have dealt with and if so, what did you do to remedy it? Hopefully this question and answer will assist someone else that has been wondering the same after getting into this hobby. Thank you in advance to anyone's wisdom.

[devildog1986]

I've noticed that my water flow is hindered by the filtration block filling up with junk and this affects the skimming on my tank. This is pretty apparent when I pull the block out to clean it and the ATO immediately comes on and puts some water in the tank. Is there any "good" way around this that also allows good mechanical filtration or do I just need to clean the filter block more regularly. I usually clean it when I notice the skimmer isn't doing it's work as much as it does normally. Please don't think I'm being neglectful because I do monitor this daily but it's definitely a noticeable thing and the ATO isn't putting so much water in the tank that I think it's swinging the salinity in an unsafe manner.

Today I noticed the return pump area on my sump in the 34G was pretty low on water despite the rest of the system being "normal". The flow coming out of the return pump was definitely weaker than normal too. I"m going to check it out more tomorrow in the day time but I just wanted to ask if this was something that other people have dealt with and if so, what did you do to remedy it? Hopefully this question and answer will assist someone else that has been wondering the same after getting into this hobby. Thank you in advance to anyone's wisdom.

Are you talking about the "Marine Pure" blocks?

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[Jimbo662]

If you have the blocks set up to force the flow through it to another section of the sump you'll definitely get more build up that blocks the flow. In this scenario you should periodically rinse it with during water changes to dislodge as much gunk as you can. I've always put mine longways in the flow. This way larger particles will go around it but it'll still get lower / slower flow through it. And yes, as soon as you pull the block out the ATO should trigger because the block will initially pull a lot of water out with it and you're removing some mass that was taking up room so the ATO is trying to replace that mass.

Possibly same with the pump...may have gunk built up inside and just needs a soak in some water / vinegar.

[Dan H]

Why use the filter block at all? I'm not a fan of any mechanical filtration for this reason. It's a PITA to keep clean and it's also removing good coral food.

[Sascha D.]

You said mechanical filtration so I'm guessing it's a sponge filter blocks or similar. Filter blocks and filter bags clog up quickly. How quickly depends on the tank and how fast detritus builds up. If you decide to use one then you'll have to clean it every three days or so. The water will back up against the block as it gets full. If it gets too full, then the water will start to go around the side or over the top of the block. Some people swear by mechanical filtration and some people hate them. I've seen more than one Tank of the Month post using filter bags.

Marine Pure Blocks is a recycled idea. It's designed to function similar to bio balls as a live rock substitute. Bio balls and wet/dry filters became less popular because of the maintenance involved to prevent clogging. Detritus will build on it and other live rock in the sump. I siphon out the detritus every six months. You can also put a filter sponge in the baffles and blast it with a power head.

[BornToHula]

Mesh filter socks are the only kind of mechanical filtration that I like because they are so easy to clean. In regards to the filter slowing down the water flow, there is really only three options. 1. Clean the filter more often 2. Get a more porous filter 3. Don't run any mechanical filtration. Each option has its benefits and drawbacks in filtering capability and convenience.

Pretty much all mechanical filtration has to be cleaned several times a week, either because they get gunked up with detritus or they start producing nitrates.

Another solution is the Theiling Roller Mat (http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/automatic-roller-mat-theiling-1.html). It apparently works great and doesn't have to be cleaned more than once a month. It would be overkill on a 34g tank though.

[Sascha D.]

That thing is crazy Hula! I'm always amazed at the new products that come out. Can you imagine what that roll of used fleece is going to smell like after a month?

[BornToHula]

That thing is crazy Hula! I'm always amazed at the new products that come out. Can you imagine what that roll of used fleece is going to smell like after a month?

I imagine pretty bad! Not that my skimmer or filter socks don't already smell terrible

[Timfish]

I'm in the group that doesn't use mechanical filtration. There might be times when you might want to run mechanical filtration temporarily and filter socks can usually be easily used in those situations. To add more detail to Dan's point about feeding corals fish poop has critical nitrogen and phosphate as well as calcium and magnesium carbonate crystals that form in fish guts.

[FarmerTy]

I'm in the group that doesn't use mechanical filtration. There might be times when you might want to run mechanical filtration temporarily and filter socks can usually be easily used in those situations. To add more detail to Dan's point about feeding corals fish poop has critical nitrogen and phosphate as well as calcium and magnesium carbonate crystals that form in fish guts.

Omg, Tim and I agree on something! Call in the parade and fireworks! [emoji4]

I haven't used mechanical filtration in 6 years, unless you count skimming but that's not what everyone is talking about here.

[+FluxCapacitor]

Ok sorry about not being clear, I was referring to foam block filters... not marine pure. I guess the main reason I have them in there is because the sexy shrimp in the sump like to go through the baffles. I guess I could use some of that knitting plastic mesh stuff to keep them out of there and get rid of the filter block. I always find one or two of them hanging out on top of the filter block when I look in the sump and I know they'd get sucked into the return pump if I removed it. Right now I have a bag of rubble rock underneath the foam filter block too, maybe I should just leave the bag of rubble rock there and do as I said above and block the baffles that go into the return area. If you all say that mechanical filtration is removing my coral food, I want to get rid of it. I already have tie-on filter sock on the drain pipe to catch any junk coming in from the DT.

I also had a carbon sheet in there between the filter block and the rubble rock bag and that thing was definitely clogged up with stuff the coral could be eating. I removed it last night after Reburn told me it would be a phosphate/nitrate factory from leaving it in there for any length of time. I want to move towards using reactors to control the water better rather than mechanical filtration. I also have a sump that has a lot of chaeto in it thanks to KimP's kindness in letting me have some of her's. Will all the feather worms that live in the chaeto get into the DT easier if I remove the filter block?

[devildog1986]

Ok sorry about not being clear, I was referring to foam block filters... not marine pure. I guess the main reason I have them in there is because the sexy shrimp in the sump like to go through the baffles. I guess I could use some of that knitting plastic mesh stuff to keep them out of there and get rid of the filter block. I always find one or two of them hanging out on top of the filter block when I look in the sump and I know they'd get sucked into the return pump if I removed it. Right now I have a bag of rubble rock underneath the foam filter block too, maybe I should just leave the bag of rubble rock there and do as I said above and block the baffles that go into the return area. If you all say that mechanical filtration is removing my coral food, I want to get rid of it. I already have tie-on filter sock on the drain pipe to catch any junk coming in from the DT.

I also had a carbon sheet in there between the filter block and the rubble rock bag and that thing was definitely clogged up with stuff the coral could be eating. I removed it last night after Reburn told me it would be a phosphate/nitrate factory from leaving it in there for any length of time. I want to move towards using reactors to control the water better rather than mechanical filtration. I also have a sump that has a lot of chaeto in it thanks to KimP's kindness in letting me have some of her's. Will all the feather worms that live in the chaeto get into the DT easier if I remove the filter block?

There's no way around it, they help keep the water clear. All you can do is keep up with maintenance and clean them. When you said filter blocks. I was trying to figure out why you were cleaning them. In my head doing so, would mean getting rid of beneficial bacteria. The foam ones, all you can do is remove them. Some people like the felt filter socks. They help lower the amount of times you have to clean the black sponges. However, with the felt socks I have 7 pairs, and change them as often as possible. Might be over kill, but I don't like for them to get to the point that they change color. If you don't up-keep them, you run the risk of increasing your nitrates. Hope this answer your question.

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[Sascha D.]

There are a lot of ways to enjoy the hobby and everyone has a different opinion. It's very subjective. I don't agree with some of the previous posts, but that doesn't mean that I'm right or that they're wrong. Not only that, but many comments are too short to understand the full meaning behind them. There are beautiful tanks using mechanical filtration and also ones that don't use it. It depends on how the tank is set up. Do corals intake fish byproduct? Yes. Will they starve if you use mechanical filtration? Probably not. Why? Well, someone that doesn't use mechanical is using something else instead. Maybe they're doing more water changes or have over-sized skimmers. They could also be dosing carbon or using chemical filtration methods in a reactor. Some people stock their tank to the limit and some people don't have many fish, thus don't need mechanical filtration.

"Beware anyone who says his or her system (methodology) is "The best"" Eric Borneman

Take a look at this quote from Timfish's signature. The biggest lesson that I learned in the hobby was to find what works for me. I experimented and failed at a few things, but I know who I am as a hobbyists. Find a tank that you admire, look at why it works, and then incorporate parts of it into your own system. A lot of equipment in the hobby is for ease and not necessarily required. Buying a big skimmer or adding chemical reactors might allow you to stock heavily, do less mechanical filtration or do less water changes. Using a riding lawnmower to cut your grass is faster, more comfortable and more accurate, but you could still do it with a push mower.

[Dan H]

^^^^^^^^

As stated above, there are a million ways to do it, and do it well - so you've got to figure out what works for you.

To expand on why I have no mechanical filtration in my tank comes down to a few things. I'm a believer in keep it simple, and create as few maintenance points as possible... I know I'm lazy. If I constantly have to do maintenance on the tank, it makes it less enjoyable to me. The other problem is anything that requires maintenance more frequently than once a week creates problems when going on vacation. Meg and I have made travel a high priority in our lives, and to be able to do so we need to have confidence that our tank won't crash when away and in the hands of a care-taker.

Mechanical filtration generally has to be cleaned reasonably frequently, ideally every few days. Poo on that. If you don't clean it frequently, it blocks up, and all that bad stuff starts to rot / die and makes even worse water quality.

Mechanical filtration does remove a lot of good stuff. It does remove some bad stuff too... But I'm going to argue it's nothing that a skimmer can't do just as well.

The only thing about no mechanical filtration is that sometimes my water has a bit more particulate matter or isn't quite as polished. I really could care less about that.

No mechanical filtration costs less.

Mechanical filters smell.

That's my logic. Doesn't mean it's right or wrong. It's just how I do.

[+FluxCapacitor]

Thank you all. I think the take away for me here is to do what I enjoy doing the most as long as the animals are happy. I don't want to have a high maintenance system.

Also, my "sock" doesn't clog quickly because it's a probably a super huge micron rating. I don't even think it's meant to be used as a filter sock as much as it's a "media bag". Detritus will definitely go right through it but larger pieces of stuff that make it into the overflow will not... there's rarely anything worth noting even in it. The sump came with a felt sock and I quickly found that I hated it because it would clog with the tiniest things that wouldn't even wash out under hot running water.... or required way too much work to clean. I considered briefly to keep multiple socks so I could just change it out to a clean one but then my laziness got the best of me and I decided to use the media bag. I mainly don't want something sucked into the skimmer pump and messing w/ it's job. The skimmer is a bit oversized for the system I'm using it on so I think it will handle this.

[HarleyGuy]

I'm sure there are many sides to this story, but here is mine :-):

I use Marine Pure blocks as additional bio-filtration so that I don't need quite as much live rock. I agree on placing them sideways in the flow (not blocking flow). They provide a ton of surface area without resulting in the detritus build up that bio-balls cause.

If you are using filter pad, floss, sock, etc..., you need to change it regularly. "Regularly" would be variable depending on fish load and feeding habits, but I change (replace) mine weekly.

I hope this helps.

-- John

[Sascha D.]

Thank you all. I think the take away for me here is to do what I enjoy doing the most as long as the animals are happy. I don't want to have a high maintenance system.

I think the best hobbyists are those people who wanted to keep something and fixed issues that arose when they tried. It's more of an evolution than a journey. You want to keep zoas, six months later they are mostly brown, you make adjustments and they start to color up. Evolution. I think it's important to start with a good base. Try some stuff, learn, adjust, and keep chuggin'!

When Mike introduced Steve Tyree he said that he found a way to keep SPS when everyone else said it wasn't possible. In hindsight we know that the lights weren't strong enough and the nutrients were too high. He had to tweak his system to find that out though. Problems come up after you set up a system and you find little corrections to make it better as a whole. One tweak at a time.

[+FluxCapacitor]

Sorry, I didn't see the replies here before.... I think the "one change at a time" thing applies to many things I do. I work on cars as a hobby and computers to make Jon gold. The rule holds true there as well, you don't go changing a bunch of things and hoping for the best because that typically causes you to not be able to pinpoint what change brought the desired result.

Thank you for the good advice and taking time to explain things.

[Timfish]

I'm in the group that doesn't use mechanical filtration. There might be times when you might want to run mechanical filtration temporarily and filter socks can usually be easily used in those situations. To add more detail to Dan's point about feeding corals fish poop has critical nitrogen and phosphate as well as calcium and magnesium carbonate crystals that form in fish guts.

Omg, Tim and I agree on something! Call in the parade and fireworks! [emoji4]

I haven't used mechanical filtration in 6 years, unless you count skimming but that's not what everyone is talking about here.

OMG! That's almost as scary as the presidential election!

[Isaac]

i went w/ a slightly "larger" pore foam block... primarily to catch the slime" when the carbon dosing catches up. I also liek that its catching bigger things i dont want in my DT. I swap mine out weekly.. i have 3 in rotation, not a big deal.

I also use "large koi pond filter" directly under the return from the DT, catches snails and uneaten food... guess it just depends how often you wanna maintain things really.