Working on a SW tank for CHS (Newbie)

[Makena95GT]

I graduated from Connally High School in 2011. Since then I've been gong back every day during the school year to manage and take care of over 100 freshwater fish in over 20 aquariums, including a pond out back that we built. There aren't many students interested in helping me with any of these tanks in the Aquatic Science class. I typically get about 2 "apprentices" a year. This year we have finally decided to move forward and get together a saltwater tank. There is a long 35 gallon aquarium up at the front of the room, on a stand, that has been empty and saved for a year.. Just for this occasion. I have NO experience in SW so I have decided to start up my own 20 gallon high SW tank,

This morning I went to PetCo (Literally walking distance from my house and on the way to the school) And grabbed a 20lb bag of the Instant Ocean Sea salt. I've been researching SW all summer, as I would HATE to have a fish die because I didn't do my homework.

Anyways.. I cleaned the tank out with freshwater as well as let the filters run for a few days and a powerhead on, just to be sure the water didn't have any little particles flying around. I mixed up 20 gallons of saltwater when I got to the school around 12pm I checked the salinity, was hovering at 1.024 when I left at 2pm.

The tank has two "20 gallon" rated filters on it. The water is treated tap water. I turned on the filters and powerhead before I left to be sure the salt gets circulated everywhere (if that's right)

I'd like suggestions on doing a pro-fish cycle with maybe one or two damselfish. I've never none a fishless cycle before, and I have also never lost a fish due to cycling. Also I currently have no job, and everything that involves these tanks is coming out of my pocket. When I was working, I spent well over 80% of my income on these tanks. Which was a LOT of money. I wont have a job until November, but I'd like to try to get this SW tank up and going before the next semester, so that I will have the experience to do the "main" SW tank, and do it right.

Also suggestions on where to get fish, what fish I can/should get. I'm looking for lots of color in this tank. The back of the tank is blacked out, and the substrate is also a dark color, so anything that would pop on a dark background would be awesome. Also, let me know if I have don't anything wrong. I'll take any criticism.

I know this is a loooong post but I'm very concerned about this tank, and honestly, can't get my job in November without saltwater experience (Trying to work at an aquarium)

[George Monnat Jr]

The key ingredients are patience and research, including reading these forums and asking lots of questions. I'm sure Tim will point you to the best book sources. Welcome to the ARC forums.

[victoly]

I graduated from Connally High School in 2011. Since then I've been gong back every day during the school year to manage and take care of over 100 freshwater fish in over 20 aquariums, including a pond out back that we built. There aren't many students interested in helping me with any of these tanks in the Aquatic Science class. I typically get about 2 "apprentices" a year. This year we have finally decided to move forward and get together a saltwater tank. There is a long 35 gallon aquarium up at the front of the room, on a stand, that has been empty and saved for a year.. Just for this occasion. I have NO experience in SW so I have decided to start up my own 20 gallon high SW tank,

This morning I went to PetCo (Literally walking distance from my house and on the way to the school) And grabbed a 20lb bag of the Instant Ocean Sea salt. I've been researching SW all summer, as I would HATE to have a fish die because I didn't do my homework.

Anyways.. I cleaned the tank out with freshwater as well as let the filters run for a few days and a powerhead on, just to be sure the water didn't have any little particles flying around. I mixed up 20 gallons of saltwater when I got to the school around 12pm I checked the salinity, was hovering at 1.024 when I left at 2pm.

The tank has two "20 gallon" rated filters on it. The water is treated tap water. I turned on the filters and powerhead before I left to be sure the salt gets circulated everywhere (if that's right)

I'd like suggestions on doing a pro-fish cycle with maybe one or two damselfish. I've never none a fishless cycle before, and I have also never lost a fish due to cycling. Also I currently have no job, and everything that involves these tanks is coming out of my pocket. When I was working, I spent well over 80% of my income on these tanks. Which was a LOT of money. I wont have a job until November, but I'd like to try to get this SW tank up and going before the next semester, so that I will have the experience to do the "main" SW tank, and do it right.

Also suggestions on where to get fish, what fish I can/should get. I'm looking for lots of color in this tank. The back of the tank is blacked out, and the substrate is also a dark color, so anything that would pop on a dark background would be awesome. Also, let me know if I have don't anything wrong. I'll take any criticism.

I know this is a loooong post but I'm very concerned about this tank, and honestly, can't get my job in November without saltwater experience (Trying to work at an aquarium)

The austin aquarium ?

I advocate a fishless cycle if you're not gonna plunk down a bunch of live rock in the tank. It's just easier and less likely to result in the unnecessary death of an animal.

[kingjames]

i would skip the damsels in a 20g as they will become problematic(very territorial) in such small space, if it were me i would get some bacteria, some mature seeded substrate from a member or lfs and some live rock and let it cycle on its own, then after cycle try a fish and some invertabrates, but go slow, you will most likely get some algae issues for the first couple months, then should go away with good husbantry practices and a decent clean up crew. Once your water paramaters are stable and you have some kind of light( at least 2 1/2 watts per gallon min IMO) then scan the for sale forums for some easy to keep corals. or hit me up and i can give you some soft easy corals to try your hand at. Reasearch is key and definetly ask lots of question on this forum

[Makena95GT]

Yes, I'm trying for the Austin Aquarium If I don't get SW experience, I'll be running the registers >.> I've talked multiple times with Vince.. Not so much his brother. But I'd LOOOOVE to work there.

Alrighty then guys.. Live rock.. Where to acquire some? I KNOW PetCo has some, they just got a huge shipment in the other time I was there, and I was making jokes about the rock being well-cultured and visiting different countries The only issue with these LFS is that I go to the school at 9am, and most don't open till at least an hour after that, and are well out of the way from my route. I drive a gas-guzzling Mustang that never has more than a quarter tank So I cant travel very far at all

Fishless cycle.. I guess I'm down to try anything at this point. I'll need a good rundown on how to go about that. I'm dying to just throw all kinds of stupid stuff in there but after years of FW, I know I have to be patient.. Which is not my strong point. All of my hobbies require patience that DO NOT have lol
(Gardening)

[kingjames]

petco is usually over priced, there is some for sale for 3.25$ a pound in the livestock section at the moment, and FISHLESS cycle, Bottle of bacteria, mabe a little live rock and you can even use a piece of raw seafood to get the cycle started, better to get some substrate of rock out of an already mature tank though, then just wait and test, can take a week up to two months depending on variables. If you dont have test kits then you need to get them, but for right now almost all LFS will give you free testing of your water if you bring them a sample.

[Makena95GT]

Is it possible to use mature substrate from a FW tank? I'm wondering if the bacteria are the same in both waters. I have a ridiculous amount of substrate in all my FW tanks lol it wold be nice if I could use that. And free

I have a ton of test kits thanks to having access to all of the stuff in the chemistry closet. I know for sure there's a saltwater test kit. Just need to hunt it down.

Would bait shrimp cont as raw seafood? I would assume it's not treated with anything. They're just frozen shrimpi use when i go fishing. Also free since I already have some

[George Monnat Jr]

Checkout Patrick's great starter post.

And this for places to find LR:

Welcome! There's Stinky's Fish Mart in Manor. Are you more north or south? Northwest there's River City Aquatics (RCA), my favorite and ARC supporter, and south central is Aqua-Dome (AD). There are also Fish Gallery, Fishy Business, Gallery of Pets and Aqua Tek in north, central Austin.

[esacjack]

are you waiting for a job at austin aquarium? werent they just shut down essentially?

Ive only cycled with a fish once, and I still have it (yellow belly damsel). Started with a good live sand/rock combination though... To cycle my tanks these days, I add a good sized chunk of "Rod's Food". After a few days I was already seeing ammonia, within a week nitrites and nitrates...

As for your rock/sand, that'll 'work' but it's not optimal. The club has a 'Free' section you should check out, generally people give away sand/rock/heaters/livestock, etc... To seed dead sand or 'rocks', you'll have to use something thats live, and then you'll have to seed it with microfauna (micro stars, mama mia worms, etc..)

Live sales online are great for getting livestock, we also have several local resources, like Austin Aqua Farms, Aquatek, Aquadome, River City Aquatics, etc, etc etc...

Whatever you do go slow, take your time... Also remember for every solution you get from us, someone will always have a different suggestion. Figure out what works for you in a small tank, and then move on.

Welcome to the club!

And dont forget to check out the resources section across the top of the webpage. It's filled with valuable information.

[(Bio)³]

So if you start this tank that's all the experience they need for you yo run the sw tanks at the aquarium?

[Makena95GT]

No sir they weren't shut down at all. There is a lot of bad press and hype going around, but I can say after going to the location myself and looking at what all they already have going on, everything is being done proper and as far as I can tell the bad media and hype is just a big ol' bandwagon thing. Vince is a genuinely good guy. He's been very helpful and understanding about my situation with working at the aquarium and my own health-problems preventing me from working anywhere else at the moment. So long as he hires more people like me that have the drive to do right, I think the place will be fine.

So ideally, what would be the easiest way to go for cycling? I've been sitting here on the computer since I first posted, just combing through the web to soak in as much info as possible. I could probably invest in some live sand and live rock. Would that be all I need to cycle? Or would I need more? (Noob question)

[Makena95GT]

So if you start this tank that's all the experience they need for you yo run the sw tanks at the aquarium?

Oh no, goodness no. If I get a decent amount of experience in, they will let me at least be AROUND the tanks. They would never let me run the tanks at the aquarium. I have to prove that I want to be able to work with the fish and help out. I'd probably still be working up front, but at least then I could help with anything that needs to be done. There are a few marine biologists that will be the ones actually running the tanks. It's mainly just to be able to get my foot in the door and be able to get trained as someone who could help out.

[Makena95GT]

esacjack, I just realized that you live VERY close to me. And the High School. LOL. I'm more or less in the little square that Parmer, Dessau, Lamar, and Braker make. Copperfield to be exact.

[esacjack]

sand and rock can start the cycle sure... I cycled my nano with rock and sand and fish food just remember to add livestock slowly, 1 at a time, and then test your levels after 24 hours. Yah thats really close to me... now I'll know who's looking through my windows late at night...

[Timfish]

My ears are burning! Delbeek and Sprung's "The Reef Aquarium" Vol III covers water chemestry and what I like discusses the most common filtering methodologies from the pumpless, skimmerless and sumpless systems by Lee Chin Eng and Dr. Jaubert to the very complex "Microcosm" approach by Dr. Adey.

Is that a Tokay Gecko?

[Makena95GT]

LMAO yup, ever see a creepy little chick with a leopard gecko sitting on her hat, that wold be me. Or even better, ever see some idiot driving a convertible mustang with the top down no matter what the weather.. that's me too White 95 GT. As far as I know, only car like that in Austin..

Ill tr for the live rock/sand and fishie food method. Hopefully beg one of my parents for some cash. My birthday was on Monday so maybe it'll be a late birthday present?

Now for the important part.. Planning my livestock. I have my heart set on a clownfish.. Of course.. because I'm soooo original After some research it seems like they are fairly easy fish to keep from dropping dead? Anything else I might look into? I'll have to take a trip so one of these local shops to get some face-to-face advise soon.

[Makena95GT]

My ears are burning! Delbeek and Sprung's "The Reef Aquarium" Vol III covers water chemestry and what I like discusses the most common filtering methodologies from the pumpless, skimmerless and sumpless systems by Lee Chin Eng and Dr. Jaubert to the very complex "Microcosm" approach by Dr. Adey.

Is that a Tokay Gecko?

haha nope, my Leopard Gecko. I have a breeding pair here in my room. Thats the male, TeeCee. He's a stud. he female is patternless, so she's just an ugly brown I have eggs incubating as we speak, should see a hatching here in the next week or so. Might try to sell some babies if I get enough interest. I already had a teacher say he wants to buy two babies

[esacjack]

LMAO yup, ever see a creepy little chick with a leopard gecko sitting on her hat, that wold be me. Or even better, ever see some idiot driving a convertible mustang with the top down no matter what the weather.. that's me too White 95 GT. As far as I know, only car like that in Austin..

Ill tr for the live rock/sand and fishie food method. Hopefully beg one of my parents for some cash. My birthday was on Monday so maybe it'll be a late birthday present?

Now for the important part.. Planning my livestock. I have my heart set on a clownfish.. Of course.. because I'm soooo original After some research it seems like they are fairly easy fish to keep from dropping dead? Anything else I might look into? I'll have to take a trip so one of these local shops to get some face-to-face advise soon.

You cant go wrong with a clown. I think pretty much everyone here has at least one, if not a pair.. I like my wrasse, goby's, blenny's, damsels, clowns, chromi's, anthelias... all beautiful fish. Are you planning on doing any coral?

[jestep]

Definitely don't use the FW substrate. All of the bacteria in it will die off.

If you're looking for budget method, get dry rock and sand, and a raw chunk of a wild shrimp to create the ammonia for the cycle. Once you get it filled and the layout you want, toss a small piece of the shrimp in there with some decent water flow and give it a month. Don't need to risk sacrificing a fish, and it's pretty much a guarantee to work. Then be prepared for several waves of different types of algaes for the first 6 - 12 months or more.

Your biggest issue if you plan on using tap water is going to be algae control. There are so many nutrients in tap water, especially in Austin, that it's going to be very difficult not to end up with an algae mess. I know it's been done but a 20 gallon might be a real test of biology. Also make sure to pre-treat any tap with Prime or another chloramine remover as it will otherwise kill beneficial bacteria and organisms in any tank, but really wreaks havoc on saltwater tanks.

As far as tank size goes a clown or pair is no problem if they're oscellaris or perculas. I would avoid larger species like maroons, clarki, tomato, etc.

[Makena95GT]

Ideally wold love to have some coral as well. I've actually never had too much of a problem with algae before. But then again all of my tanks have at least one pleco in them I guess when the algae blooms I'll jump in on some form of algae cleaning crew.

I was looking at the oscellaris clowns at PetCo today.. Love them. Also love the Blenny that is there.. I honestly can't remember what kind it was, but he was super cute. There was also a fsh that looks like he has arms, and perches on the rocks.. Can't remember the name.. I'm sure you guys know exactly what im talking about. But I loved that guy too. Then I got distracted by the kittens.. and since I used to volunteer . I have a key to the cages. And I played with them for a bit before finally getting my salt and leaving

[esacjack]

jestep knows what he's talking about.. I missed the tap water part... tap water is bad... mmkay? RO/DI is the way to go, and can be purchased by the gallon at all of the local fish stores.. relatively inexpensive...

[esacjack]

Ideally wold love to have some coral as well. I've actually never had too much of a problem with algae before. But then again all of my tanks have at least one pleco in them I guess when the algae blooms I'll jump in on some form of algae cleaning crew.

I was looking at the oscellaris clowns at PetCo today.. Love them. Also love the Blenny that is there.. I honestly can't remember what kind it was, but he was super cute. There was also a fsh that looks like he has arms, and perches on the rocks.. Can't remember the name.. I'm sure you guys know exactly what im talking about. But I loved that guy too. Then I got distracted by the kittens.. and since I used to volunteer . I have a key to the cages. And I played with them for a bit before finally getting my salt and leaving

Dont forget the inverts! tuxedo urchins, starfish... If you're wanting to do some coral, I'd start with something simple, like mushrooms, zoas, etc.. but before you can coral, you need to plan for lighting! lighting is absolutely critical to coral life!

[Makena95GT]

LOL okay Mr. Mackey

[Makena95GT]

Ideally wold love to have some coral as well. I've actually never had too much of a problem with algae before. But then again all of my tanks have at least one pleco in them I guess when the algae blooms I'll jump in on some form of algae cleaning crew.

I was looking at the oscellaris clowns at PetCo today.. Love them. Also love the Blenny that is there.. I honestly can't remember what kind it was, but he was super cute. There was also a fsh that looks like he has arms, and perches on the rocks.. Can't remember the name.. I'm sure you guys know exactly what im talking about. But I loved that guy too. Then I got distracted by the kittens.. and since I used to volunteer . I have a key to the cages. And I played with them for a bit before finally getting my salt and leaving

Dont forget the inverts! tuxedo urchins, starfish... If you're wanting to do some coral, I'd start with something simple, like mushrooms, zoas, etc.. but before you can coral, you need to plan for lighting! lighting is absolutely critical to coral life!

Ahh.. Lighting.. what I always felt like was the most expensive part of my hobby >.>

[esacjack]

haha... nah, lighting is what drives people away, but its not the most expensive....With the introduction of LED technology, power consumption and starting prices have gone down. You can also find some fantastic T5 lights on ebay for dirt cheap. Quite a few of us build our own led fixtures these days. If you like to work with your hands, have a soldering iron and meter, its the way to go.. For me, I love the challenge so I try and DIY as much as possible. Sometimes its cheaper, sometimes its not... But you can always utilize used equipment to defer the cost. Aside from all the free knowledge, the forum has an extremely active DIY and For Sale section...