Aqua-Dome Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 Having seen some discussions about the usefulness of live rock and the possibility of different infestations, I have decided to give my opinion. Aiptasia is a very unlikely pest to come in on fresh live rock, I can’t remember a time when we received a shipment of rock with any Aiptasia on it or saw any rear their ugly heads over time in the rock tank. The only time we see Aiptasia in our rock holding tank is on pieces that customers have brought in. It is much more likely that Aiptasia come from colonies of polyp corals that have been commercially grown in the wild, what conditions exist that make them proliferate in an aquarium situation are not well understood, because sometimes they don’t. Given the way live rock is shipped it is also extremely unlikely to receive any crustaceans alive, (blood sucking or not), in any shipment of live rock coming in from the pacific. You may encounter different types of worms, most are innocuous, but if the rock is kept in a holding tank like ours, where the rock is held off the bottom, those too are rare. That leaves us with the question of usefulness of live rock. Given live rock’s benefits, I consider it one of the best things that you can add to a marine environment. It’s ability to biologically establish a marine aquarium is unparalleled. Cured live rock can immediately or in a very short time make a newly established aquarium ready for it‘s first inhabitants, it can quickly introduce fauna such as macro algaes, tube worms and sponges. It is the best at giving an aquarium a stable and established head start and position it for long term success. Unfortunately some folks bash products like live sand or live rock without understanding the efficacy of such products. Even if some of the things live rock is blamed for were correct, its’ overall benefits far outweigh those factors, especially when remedies for those problems are not difficult. There is not a product that you could use to dip corals that you could not use on live rock. If you get good live rock, if you don’t add un-cured live rock to an established aquarium, if you examine the pieces that you pick, there is no reason that a selection of rock can’t do anything but help to make your marine environment healthy, vibrant and successful. Gary 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmmthree Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 Thanks Gary! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua-Dome Posted November 22, 2011 Author Share Posted November 22, 2011 You're very welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbnj Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 All valid points, but I look at live rock the same way I look at VorTech pumps and LED lighting....they all have valuable and unique/distinguishing benefits, but they're such an unnecessary expense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua-Dome Posted November 23, 2011 Author Share Posted November 23, 2011 Come on. That's an absurd analogy, Vortech and LED are types of equipment, I don't think that you would say that proper lighting or water movement are unnecessary expenses. I said that live rock was, in my opinion, one of the best things you could add to your aquarium for long-term success. Marine aquariums "worked" with undergravel filters and florescent lighting. You couldn't keep the types of things that you can now, but you could have a successful marine aquarium. I can't believe that you list the equipment that you have on your tank and claim live rock is an unnecessary expense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbnj Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 I can see how you may have misinterpreted what I said, as I didn't clearly state my opinion. Like proper lighting and water movement, I also believe that live rock is an essential element in a reef tank. It truly is one of the best things you could add to your aquarium for long-term success. However, to my original point, like creating water movement using VorTechs and lighting with LEDs, there are much less expensive (yet equally effective) ways to "create" live rock without buying it right out of the ocean. I don't have any VorTechs, LEDs, or store-bought live rock (I started with dead rock) in my tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBReefer Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 If a person was buying live rock that came from an established long running aquarium, would you do with it, if anything, before you added to another aquarium? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua-Dome Posted November 23, 2011 Author Share Posted November 23, 2011 I would say that if it looks good, use it. You could take the pieces and swish them around in a bucket of salt water before you put them in your tank, but that is about all I would do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua-Dome Posted November 23, 2011 Author Share Posted November 23, 2011 I started this thread in response to what I considered misconceptions about the virtues and/or drawbacks to using live rock in a marine aquarium. Somehow that evolved into a discussion on where to cut cost in setting up a tank. That has nothing to do with the subject of the benefits of live rock, but if you’re still reading, I will give you my opinion about that at the end. 1st: The Problems with names. “Live Rock“- no such thing. When this product first came on to the scene it was marketed under this moniker, and has stayed so ever since. It really should be called bio-diverse aquarium rock, because that is what your really paying a premium for. “Dead Rock- no such thing. Rock that is devoid of life, whether it be old coral skeletons, limestone boulders, or a cinder block, are just rocks. “Dry rock- pretty acceptable, everyone gets a pretty clear picture of what you’re talking about. The main consideration here is porousity, more porous equals lighter and more surface area bacterial colonization. 2nd: Live rock cannot cause tank disasters, with one caveat. Never put un-cured rock into an established aquarium. Poor tank management causes aquarium disasters. Unwanted tank inhabitants may be a nuisance but they are rarely a disaster and generally can be controlled in other and natural means without tearing an aquarium apart. 3rd: You cannot create live rock, you can’t even get it back to it’s original oceanic form after it reaches your local store. Because of shipping you lose some of the rich bio-diversity that it had when it was harvested, the rock is not shipped in water for freight reasons, so you do lose some of the creatures that were on it to begin with. If you start with dry rock you can make it biologically active quite easily, but if you don’t add anything with any biodiversity, you’re not going to get any biodiversity. Generally people add base rock or dry rock as a structural underlayment to cut down costs and then place more expensive live rock on top hoping organisms will colonize the cheaper rock. In this case you are trading time for money because such colonization takes time. You can not add dry rock, add dipped clean corals and expect to achieve any kind of bio-diverse rock. 4th: I still maintain that live rock is one of the best compliments for your marine aquarium. It is still going to be almost a year before you realize the full benefits of a good live rock base, it seems to take that long even with good live rock for a tank to reach the full potential of stability and consistency that the rock affords you. Now as to the issue of where to cut cost or unnecessary expense. Hobbies by their very nature are unnecessary expenses. We do a hobby because we enjoy it. The money you spend on this hobby should be based on means and what results you are trying to achieve. The types of animals you want to keep successfully, dictates the minimum equipment requirements not the maximum. A $500.00 driver is not going to make you a better golfer, it may allow you to hit the ball farther, but if don't use your irons properly or don't putt well, you’re just going to be a mediocre golfer who drives the ball a long way. A $1000.00 deltec skimmer doesn’t work in principle any different than a $200.00 coralife one, or a $20.00 air driven skimmer with a wood airstone, it may work somewhat more efficiently and will cycle the water in a big tank through it faster, but foam fractionation is foam fractionation. Some hobbyists are equipment junkies, and there is nothing wrong with that. They want the biggest, baddest, newest, most technologically advanced equipment they can get, and I say, if you want it and can afford it, more power to you. But most hobbyist don’t or can’t, and I respect them also. I cannot in good conscience tell someone that they need a $500.00 skimmer, or a $600.00 controller, or a doser, or a calcium reactor, or a dozen other things sold for an aquarium, if money is an issue you can accomplish all those things by other cheaper means. Expensive equipment may make it easier on you, but it may not do it any better. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlock Posted November 23, 2011 Share Posted November 23, 2011 what are the pitfalls to using live rock? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AquaJohn Posted November 24, 2011 Share Posted November 24, 2011 the only bad thing would be pests that may be in it when you add it to your tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe.kool Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 More biology less technology. The more live rock the less problems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe.kool Posted March 5, 2012 Share Posted March 5, 2012 I have 100lbs of good Fiji rock that I picked up from someone. He said he had bristles worms bad. What's your take on these critters? He turned lights and filter off for like 3 months. It still looks purple but not thick.what's my first step at getting this rock where it needs to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesL Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Bristleworms are a valuable part of your clean up crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+dapettit Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 More biology less technology. The more live rock the less problems Agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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