bfrench Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Hi All, Input here would be much appreciated. I'm trying to finish up my build for the 280 so that everything can be in place and ready to roll as soon as the tank gets here. One key component still up in the air is the sump. I'm having trouble finding a prefab sump that's large enough. James at envision acrylics (building the DT) recommended that the sump be at least 20% of the tank volume. So that puts me in the 60+ gallon range. They ruled out my original plan for the emerald 39 from trigger systems. I've narrowed it down to a few oprions. 1) get trigger systems to build a custom sump by lengthening the emerald out to 48in 2) trigger system tideline 48, a few less features but I can get one for 689+tax 3) Bashsea biofuge 48x18x18 Does anyone have experience with bashsea? How about their twisted skimmer? Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolt Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 I don't know bashsea, but I know Reburn has a tideline 48 for the large DT he is building. I've seen it (dry) and it looks pretty nice to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 11, 2016 Author Share Posted June 11, 2016 Thank you, I'll PM Reburn Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reburn Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 So I have a Triggersystems tideline 48. I bought this sump from another member here. I have yet to get it wet and have it running so most of my critiques are more observations and my understanding of how water flows. The Good. Overall it seems well constructed. The Cons 1). Its built of of 1/4" material. While this is ok and perfectly acceptable being as its braced I prefer to pay a bit more and get 3/8" material. This is more of a personal preference. 2). The filter socks bunch at the bottom. The platform for the filter socks could have been a touch higher where a 7" sock wouldn't have to basically be folder at the end.to fit. Because of this the sock ring doesn't fit flush on the platform and I'm sure it will let detritus by. 3). Where the drain inputs come into the sump is very hard to access and I'm sure will catch the heavy detritus and become a detritus trap. The solution to this is to put the drain inputs on the right. However this makes it where you have to reach around the plumbing to get the filter socks in and out. 4). The water level in the sump is only adjustable in one place. This makes your Fuge compartment have to run at the same height as the skimmer compartment. They have the sump designed for the skimmer first then the Fuge compartment. I prefer the opposite where the raw water comes out of the tank and any small pieces of detritus get caught into the fuge compartment to feed the microfauna in there. Then to the skimmer compartment then to the return chamber. 5). They claim 64 gallons which I'm sure is like any manufacturer which is measured by outside dimensions. I'm sure this sump runs more at about 30 gallons. If the Fuge/Skimmer water levels is addressed I'm sure you could easily pick up another 7-10 gallons of running capacity. 6). The cost. Honestly you will get more bang for you buck with Melev's Reef or Zen Reef. I find the trigger Systems and the Reef Synergy sumps to be alot of money. The reef synergy sumps at least are beautiful in every way shape and form. They however have some of the same pitfalls as listed above. The only reason I have this sump is because with some modification it will do what I want it to and it was cheap. I can't speak highly enough of Zen Reef. Tran and Tuan are an absolute pleasure to work with and do A+++ quality work. They have done 3 one off custom projects for me and each one has come out perfect. The beauty of their products can't be overstated. The same goes for Marc at Melev's reef. In my opinion you have 2 great custom acrylic smiths in Fort Worth and San Antone, I prefer to use local or Texas reefers and keep my money as local as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reburn Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornToHula Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 I haven't used a Bashsea sump, but I use a Bashsea biopellet reactor that is quite good. It has high quality workmanship, is well designed, and their customer service responded promptly to a question I had (on a Saturday). I would buy their products again. Have you considered going DIY for the sump? I used a standard 75g tank and bought glass for the baffles. It takes time/work but you can get exactly what you want without paying an arm and a leg for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 11, 2016 Author Share Posted June 11, 2016 I've been having difficulty sourcing a cheap 75 gallon. Found one at Petsco for 175. I guess that's significantly cheaper than the sumps I was looking at. Was trying to avoid glass (seam failure risk) in this build, but it might be worth saving a couple hundred dollars. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 12, 2016 Author Share Posted June 12, 2016 6). The cost. Honestly you will get more bang for you buck with Melev's Reef or Zen Reef. I find the trigger Systems and the Reef Synergy sumps to be alot of money. The reef synergy sumps at least are beautiful in every way shape and form. They however have some of the same pitfalls as listed above. The only reason I have this sump is because with some modification it will do what I want it to and it was cheap. I can't speak highly enough of Zen Reef. Tran and Tuan are an absolute pleasure to work with and do A+++ quality work. They have done 3 one off custom projects for me and each one has come out perfect. The beauty of their products can't be overstated. The same goes for Marc at Melev's reef. In my opinion you have 2 great custom acrylic smiths in Fort Worth and San Antone, I prefer to use local or Texas reefers and keep my money as local as possible. Reached out to Zen Reef; they repliedd promptly. Cost for the specs I gave them was significantly more than I wanted to spend. Will try and change the specs around to reduce overall cost. Reached out to Marc again at Melev's Reef (tired a week or two ago with no response). I've worked with glass quite a bit before in a different setting. May just have to put the effort into it and build one myself. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+FluxCapacitor Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 If you have the space for it why not just supplement the large sump that you want to buy with another large rubbermaid container (or the like). You could easily add "filtering water capacity" to your system this way without having to pay a fortune for some custom sump. I just bought a Trigger Systems (CRYS18C) sump recently and I'm very pleased with the build quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sascha D. Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 I've been having difficulty sourcing a cheap 75 gallon. Found one at Petsco for 175. I guess that's significantly cheaper than the sumps I was looking at. Was trying to avoid glass (seam failure risk) in this build, but it might be worth saving a couple hundred dollars. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Melev's Reef does custom sumps, but I'm not sure how much it would cost. I believe they're located in the Dallas area. You'd save shipping if you picked it up. A 75g build as a DIY sump will hold around 49 gallons of water while in operation. How much it holds during operation will depend on if you want to build a skimmer stand or set your baffle height to the operating depth. I wouldn't worry about that amount of force being a threat on the seams. I don't know what specifications you have in mind, but you could try CL for a used tank. Another option is to buy a poly stock/sheep tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 14, 2016 Author Share Posted June 14, 2016 If you have the space for it why not just supplement the large sump that you want to buy with another large rubbermaid container (or the like). You could easily add "filtering water capacity" to your system this way without having to pay a fortune for some custom sump. I just bought a Trigger Systems (CRYS18C) sump recently and I'm very pleased with the build quality. While I love the idea of "doing something myself" and engineering something. I did that with my current system. It works, but it was a pain, my wife hated all the fish stuff in the garage as it took me quite a while to get it all done, silicone curing etc... When we were planning the tank I purposely over estimated the budget to my wife just in case something like this came up. Since we cut down to 6 feet and eliminated a radion that allowed for additional money for the sump and protein skimmer. The idea of plumbing in another container would make it hard for me to sleep at night. I don't trust my plumbing skills. I'd rather have a single acrylic box holding 45gallons of water with an extra 45 gallon capacity just in case of power failure etc. Apparently at least 25-30 gallons will drain off the main tank in a power outage (worse case scenario assuming check valve failure). I haven't used a Bashsea sump, but I use a Bashsea biopellet reactor that is quite good. It has high quality workmanship, is well designed, and their customer service responded promptly to a question I had (on a Saturday). I would buy their products again. Have you considered going DIY for the sump? I used a standard 75g tank and bought glass for the baffles. It takes time/work but you can get exactly what you want without paying an arm and a leg for it. I decided to order one of their skimmers. I'm kicking around the idea of the bio pellet reactor, but will probably wait and see how the tank is doing after 6-12 months before spending that much on another piece of equipment. I had the same customer service experience, they're incredible. So I have a Triggersystems tideline 48. I bought this sump from another member here. I have yet to get it wet and have it running so most of my critiques are more observations and my understanding of how water flows. The Good. Overall it seems well constructed. The Cons 1). Its built of of 1/4" material. While this is ok and perfectly acceptable being as its braced I prefer to pay a bit more and get 3/8" material. This is more of a personal preference. 2). The filter socks bunch at the bottom. The platform for the filter socks could have been a touch higher where a 7" sock wouldn't have to basically be folder at the end.to fit. Because of this the sock ring doesn't fit flush on the platform and I'm sure it will let detritus by. 3). Where the drain inputs come into the sump is very hard to access and I'm sure will catch the heavy detritus and become a detritus trap. The solution to this is to put the drain inputs on the right. However this makes it where you have to reach around the plumbing to get the filter socks in and out. 4). The water level in the sump is only adjustable in one place. This makes your Fuge compartment have to run at the same height as the skimmer compartment. They have the sump designed for the skimmer first then the Fuge compartment. I prefer the opposite where the raw water comes out of the tank and any small pieces of detritus get caught into the fuge compartment to feed the microfauna in there. Then to the skimmer compartment then to the return chamber. 5). They claim 64 gallons which I'm sure is like any manufacturer which is measured by outside dimensions. I'm sure this sump runs more at about 30 gallons. If the Fuge/Skimmer water levels is addressed I'm sure you could easily pick up another 7-10 gallons of running capacity. 6). The cost. Honestly you will get more bang for you buck with Melev's Reef or Zen Reef. I find the trigger Systems and the Reef Synergy sumps to be alot of money. The reef synergy sumps at least are beautiful in every way shape and form. They however have some of the same pitfalls as listed above. The only reason I have this sump is because with some modification it will do what I want it to and it was cheap. I can't speak highly enough of Zen Reef. Tran and Tuan are an absolute pleasure to work with and do A+++ quality work. They have done 3 one off custom projects for me and each one has come out perfect. The beauty of their products can't be overstated. The same goes for Marc at Melev's reef. In my opinion you have 2 great custom acrylic smiths in Fort Worth and San Antone, I prefer to use local or Texas reefers and keep my money as local as possible. Thank you for the feedback and for "saving" me some money. I didn't realize the trigger sumps were 1/4in. So I opted to go with Bashsea. Steve the owner gave me his personal cell number and spent an 30-45 minutes with me explaining their take on sumps, the manufacturing process and why he uses 3/8in acrylic. There were also a bunch of stories swapped and he cut me a deal and is making the skimmer in red and black at no extra cost with a few modifications to match the sump. The sump will be 60x22x16 which places it around 90 gallons bringing the system total to 370 gallons. The protein skimmer section will easily accommodate their biggest skimmer and a bio reactor side by side prior to the refugium. The bio reactor is on hold for now, but Steve said he'd be happy to do it in red and black to match everything else at a later date if I decided to. I can't wait to get my hands on this. Review will be forthcoming. Also I'm getting to check out Ty's setup on Saturday so that will be a huge plus and maybe I can figure out how he gets away with no water changes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 14, 2016 Author Share Posted June 14, 2016 I've been having difficulty sourcing a cheap 75 gallon. Found one at Petsco for 175. I guess that's significantly cheaper than the sumps I was looking at. Was trying to avoid glass (seam failure risk) in this build, but it might be worth saving a couple hundred dollars. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Melev's Reef does custom sumps, but I'm not sure how much it would cost. I believe they're located in the Dallas area. You'd save shipping if you picked it up. A 75g build as a DIY sump will hold around 49 gallons of water while in operation. How much it holds during operation will depend on if you want to build a skimmer stand or set your baffle height to the operating depth. I wouldn't worry about that amount of force being a threat on the seams. I don't know what specifications you have in mind, but you could try CL for a used tank. Another option is to buy a poly stock/sheep tank. I tried that route and couldn't get a return email. Also tried contacting trigger systems (again trying to save on shipping) and got no reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornToHula Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Awesome! I'm interested to see how the sump and skimmer turn out. Glad their customer service was as good for you as they were for me. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sascha D. Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 I big question is what kind of sump that you are planning to build. A 40b is large enough to build a Berlin or a basic two chamber equipment sump. It's a small sump for a 200+ gallon aquarium and you would have to stay on top of evaporation. I would not use a Rubbermaid tote to build a sump unless you were planning on using an external skimmer. Even then, they tend to bow over time. If the power went out and one failed then you'll have a mess on your hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 14, 2016 Author Share Posted June 14, 2016 Sump is ordered should be here in 3-4 weeks and the tank in 4 weeks I big question is what kind of sump that you are planning to build. A 40b is large enough to build a Berlin or a basic two chamber equipment sump. It's a small sump for a 200+ gallon aquarium and you would have to stay on top of evaporation. I would not use a Rubbermaid tote to build a sump unless you were planning on using an external skimmer. Even then, they tend to bow over time. If the power went out and one failed then you'll have a mess on your hands. I'm not 100% sure what you mean by Berlin system, and I'm too lazy to go look it up Basically I wanted a sump that was 70+ gallons, had room for a skimmer if I wanted to use one, and had a refugium. Mechanical filtration following the refugium was also on the list. What I ordered is a custom Bashsea SS60 sump measuring 60x22x16 or just over 90 gallons. It's solid 3/8in acrylic and should hold more than enough water in the event of pump failure/power outage. The dimensions also allow for putting the skimmer and a bio pellet reactor or other reactor in the same compartment. I'm not planning on one at the moment, but the option to do it in the future is a huge plus. It also looks pretty cool and while it likely won't be on regular display it's nice to have something that looks cool. The purchase was also driven by their customer service which was incredible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reburn Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 I'm impressed with the bash sea pictures and specs. I'm sure it will be a very elegant sump. I'm actually quite excited to see it. It looks like they are pushing the edge and I'm a sucker for colors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolt Posted June 15, 2016 Share Posted June 15, 2016 I have a big sump in my future too, so looking forward to seeing pics of yours. How would you say their custom prices compared to their standard model prices, percentage wise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 15, 2016 Author Share Posted June 15, 2016 I have a big sump in my future too, so looking forward to seeing pics of yours. How would you say their custom prices compared to their standard model prices, percentage wise? I'll PM you, but frankly I was surprised. Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+BobcatReefer Posted June 15, 2016 Share Posted June 15, 2016 Following solely for sump pron pics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 15, 2016 Author Share Posted June 15, 2016 Following solely for sump pron pics.Examples that were sent to me Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolt Posted June 15, 2016 Share Posted June 15, 2016 Did you go with that color scheme? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 15, 2016 Author Share Posted June 15, 2016 Yeah I like the red and black. Blue and black was okay and the white and black looked sharp, but the red just jumped out at me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawnM Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Those look really sharp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfrench Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Sump in progress Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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