+C Lo Slice Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 As many of y'all know (those who have come over or talked to me here on ARC), I have had many documented issues with GHA. I think that it was just improper set-up on my part when I first got the tank up and running (lack of adequate flow, too long of a photoperiod, over-feeding, etc.) that has led to the near-demise of this tank. Those who have listened to my complaints lately, know that I've been considering scrapping everything and starting over. Well, it looks like the perfect time has come to do so. My wife, being from the Dallas area, has gotten a severe itch to move back so it looks like we will be doing so around early-summer next year. This current tank has served a huge purpose in teaching me the hands-on issues that no amount of research could have done. So, with that in mind, it is time to start planning my next tank, as I don't want to take this one with me (other than the LR, which I will dry out and then re-seed once when the time comes). I KNOW that I want bigger than my current 60 gallon. I'm thinking 150-210 depending on the space that we end up with. However, this tank had no plan as far as stocking. I had one in place, but once I started visiting the LFSs I would get excited and make impulse buys, which led to many deaths. The compatibility wasn't an issue as much as the order in which they were added. ANYWAYS... I was thinking what I wanted to do with the next tank is set it up to where nearly every fish serves some sort of purpose. For example, a yellow coris wrasse to control flatworms, a tang to control algae, a sand-sifting goby to clean the substrate, etc. My first priority is to make my dream stocking list for the tank size (which I haven't done yet), then add or substitute certain fish in who can serve purposes to make life more manageable. This next tank WILL have a sump (unlike my current one). I was also toying around with an idea for building a stand, in which the QT (which I don't have now) and possibly a frag tank and the fuge portion of the sump will be visible. Basically, under the DT would be the QT, below that would be the frag tank (maybe. still don't know if that is something I want), then below that would be the sump with a fuge growing macros and housing various inverts. All of those compartments would have removeable "doors," which would allow for darkness when necessary (mainly for the QT). This would also allow me to gawk over things in other tanks when I feel like it. Anywho, I got WAY off topic as I am wont to do from time to time. This was mainly to serve as a way for me to learn about the purposes that fish and various inverts (not including CUC) would serve in an easy and concise way. I'd research on my own (which I have done), but different websites say different things. I'd like to hear some first-hand experiences. Thanks, guys. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+C Lo Slice Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 Ideally, I would also hope that this thread turns into a way for both new and experienced hobbyists to reference which fish/invert does what, whether it be an emergency or a precautionary measure. I know many people (myself included) prefer to go natural routes in order to rid their tanks of pests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I know Shane's Tank at Fishy Business Stays pretty clean because he doesn't feed his fish. He has a Wrasse for worms, a Lawnmower Blenny for Algae, a Spotted Mandarin for pods, and a Yellow Tang for Algae. He only feeds his coral even other week or so but other than that, the fish live off the live rock and crushed coral substrate. A different way of thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+C Lo Slice Posted July 7, 2012 Author Share Posted July 7, 2012 I know Shane's Tank at Fishy Business Stays pretty clean because he doesn't feed his fish. He has a Wrasse for worms, a Lawnmower Blenny for Algae, a Spotted Mandarin for pods, and a Yellow Tang for Algae. He only feeds his coral even other week or so but other than that, the fish live off the live rock and crushed coral substrate. A different way of thinking. Wow, that definitely is a different way of thinking. I've never made it over to Fishy Business, but that is something I hadn't thought of. Thanks for the input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sascha D. Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I've seen the tank at Fishy Business. Its about 180 gallons and is pretty clean but the livestock is basically nonexistant. No fish is above 2 inches and theres only 5 or 6 corals in there with 200lbs of LR. From the outside of the shop it looks like a tank filled with rocks. Here's a couple of utility livestock I know: Lawnmower Blenny for air algae Six-line Wrasse for bristleworms Mandarin Goby for pods Tangs for rock cleaning Banded Sleeper Goby for sand sifting Orange Spot Goby for sand sifting Goatfish for sand sifting Copperband Butterfly for aiptasia Linkia Star for Cleaner Shrimp Emerald Crab for bubble algae Sand Sifting Star for sandbed circulation Peppermint Shrimp for aiptasia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migs Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I have seen the tank as well... I have walked in when he is vacuuming the rock to keep it clean. It looks great - too much rock for my taste. Not sure how much of the tank looking clean is due to his maintenance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I've seen the tank at Fishy Business. Its about 180 gallons and is pretty clean but the livestock is basically nonexistant. No fish is above 2 inches and theres only 5 or 6 corals in there with 200lbs of LR. From the outside of the shop it looks like a tank filled with rock. It's a 135 and he had numerous great colonies of sps, lps, and softies. His a/c unit went out about 7 months ago when he had his weekend off and it pretty much cooked everything. he in the rebuilding stage right now but gets great growth and cleanliness. No reactors, no power heads, no dosing, No halides or LEDs. Idk. But the reason I brought up his tank is because its a purpose fish tank. He's definitely part of the gobs of live rock belief. Depends on your taste. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesL Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I have found my tangs to be great at algae control. Much better than snails. Arrow crabs will deal with bristleworms (but they can be a good part of a tank). Wrasses, like others have said, are good controls of flatworms, flukes, pest snails. Some wrasses will also serve as cleaners of fish. Butterflies are good at pest anemone control, but will turn on corals when the pests are exhausted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 If you wanted a self sufficient tank, you would just have to give up Anthias, Firefish, Clownfish, or any Carnivore fish that couldn't live off your live rock/substrate. Which is totally doable, just up to your taste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niko's Reef Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 Good topic. I feel you Caleb about being at LFS stores and making impulse buys. Have that same problem. That and when I go to ARC members who are having huge sales or shutting down tanks. I'm starting a new 75. Going to take my time when it comes to stocking this time. Luckily I haven't ran into any problems with jumping the gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bayou Posted July 8, 2012 Share Posted July 8, 2012 Very cool topic! Between my personal tanks and the systems at the farm I have used a lot of biological control. Here are some of my favorites: Orange shoulder tang for algae Yellow tang for algae Hippo tang for algae (get 2 or 3 tangs all with different shaped snouts- evolved to eat different types of algae) Six line wrasse for worms/nudies Copperband butterflies- aptasia Peppermint shrimp - aptasia Fish poop is the best coral food so get some fish that can make some noise to keep the corals happy- tangs/triggers Along the same line, nutrient export is always good, a large remote deep sand bed and/or macro algae or algae scrubber is good. Mexican turbos are great! Be sure to get the warm water(gulf) not cool water (pacific) We have always had mixed luck with crabs. Sea hares are very good for turf algae. And they don't die after the spawn.... But they are a mess when they do die. If you need info on stores in DFW shoot me a pm and I'll save you some time and point you to the good ones. --- I am here: http://tapatalk.com/map.php?zknlna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sascha D. Posted July 8, 2012 Share Posted July 8, 2012 I've seen the tank at Fishy Business. Its about 180 gallons and is pretty clean but the livestock is basically nonexistant. No fish is above 2 inches and theres only 5 or 6 corals in there with 200lbs of LR. From the outside of the shop it looks like a tank filled with rock. It's a 135 and he had numerous great colonies of sps, lps, and softies. His a/c unit went out about 7 months ago when he had his weekend off and it pretty much cooked everything. he in the rebuilding stage right now but gets great growth and cleanliness. No reactors, no power heads, no dosing, No halides or LEDs. Idk. But the reason I brought up his tank is because its a purpose fish tank. He's definitely part of the gobs of live rock belief. Depends on your taste. Thats a shame about his tank. I saw it three weeks ago but he never mentioned anything when we were talking about it. I have found my tangs to be great at algae control. Much better than snails. Arrow crabs will deal with bristleworms (but they can be a good part of a tank). Wrasses, like others have said, are good controls of flatworms, flukes, pest snails. Some wrasses will also serve as cleaners of fish. Butterflies are good at pest anemone control, but will turn on corals when the pests are exhausted. I've always heard bad things about arrow crabs. I wouldn't put one in my tank if I had a fish below 4 inches. I would also avoid bristle stars; I had one go rogue about five years ago and it decimated my clowns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted July 8, 2012 Share Posted July 8, 2012 Sea Urchins for algae control. Read up on Dr. Martin Moes research on the demise of Diadema spp. urchins in the Caribean and the negative impact the dieoff had on the reefs. I like the Royal and Tuxedo urchins but am also happy with the green and pink shortspine urchins. Somepeople don't like the way they pick up frags and carry them around but I just make sure frags are stuck well. I am a huge fan of brittle/serpent stars and have not had any problem with them over the years. (Funny but the one animal I have had more problems with over the years more than any other are Bubble Tip Anemonies. The cost of the animals BTAs have killed off as they walk around or as they reproduce then walk around is many, many times the cost of the damage done by the mantis shrimp I've come across [$0.00] or Krakon worms [ < $100.00] or Gorrilla crabs [$0.00]. I've found Aiptasia are much less a problem and easier to deal with than BTA's. Having to do hundreds of dollars in damage trearing apart established coral colonies to get to a BTA clone that has split and crawled into the middle of them and is killing them off I've found is really annoying.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesL Posted July 8, 2012 Share Posted July 8, 2012 Yeah, I wasn't really advocating arrow crabs as they can be predators of fish. I have thought about adding one to try dealing with some euclid worms I have, but didn't want to put small fish at risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClarkiiCircus Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 All my fish serve the purpose of entertaining me Remember when you're building, that once a food source for a particular role is gone, you will either need to remove that animal, or begin to feed the tank yourself (If you choose not to feed your tank at all, which I would NEVER recommend). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sascha D. Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 All my fish serve the purpose of entertaining me Remember when you're building, that once a food source for a particular role is gone, you will either need to remove that animal, or begin to feed the tank yourself (If you choose not to feed your tank at all, which I would NEVER recommend). I would have to agree.Just because an animal eats something doesn't mean that's ALL they eat in the wild. Even a yellow tang needs more than 200 lbs of LR to graze on and multiple variations of vegitable matter to stay healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 I know Shane's Tank at Fishy Business Stays pretty clean because he doesn't feed his fish. He has a Wrasse for worms, a Lawnmower Blenny for Algae, a Spotted Mandarin for pods, and a Yellow Tang for Algae. He only feeds his coral even other week or so but other than that, the fish live off the live rock and crushed coral substrate. A different way of thinking. I know of a 55 FOWLR system which had a Yellow Tank, Blue Fiji Devel Damsel and a Coral Banded Shrimp that were not fed for several years and the three were in excellent condition. Irregardless of the feeding regime an aquarist uses or the number of fish a system is stocked with the overriding consideration should be are the fish maintaining a good body wieght. The two indicators I use are one: Is the belly of the fish a smooth curve from the side down to the bottom of the fish, it should not be bloated or sunken. Second: Is the curve of the fish across the face, forehead and across the back a smooth continuous curve. A fish that is underwieght the outline of the fishes skull can be distinguished by a pinched appearance of the back adjacent to the head. A fish that is overwieght the outline of the skull can be distinguished by a hump starting at the edge of the skull where fat deposits are stored on the back. There are going to be fish that defy an aquarists best efforts. I have Lawnmower Blennie in one tank that looks like it swallowed a 1" diameter marble and cutting back on the amount of food I feed to the other fish is pointless as the blennie feeds almost exclusively off algae in the tank. Conversely, even with lightly stocked tanks one fish may be so aggressive eating it will be obese compared to the rest of the tank or a fish may be unusually shy and not eat enough. Unfortunately there are also diseases that are essentially undiagnosable and untreatable that will cause a fish to look over or underwieght but this also should not be a reason for an aquarist to justify not evaluating and trying to correct feeding issues. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 All my fish serve the purpose of entertaining me . . . Here, Here! This is probably the most important consideration in determining the risk/benefit of chosing animals for our tanks. I really like having green brittle stars in my tanks. They have a lot of "wow" or "what the . . .!! " power when people see them waving thier arms around and they are great scavengers. There are reports of them eating fish but from my experience with them living for years with small fish I'm inclined to think the fish was ill or dead when the brittle star found it and the brittle star is just doing it's job . By contrast I'd rather not put more than one Yellow or Purple tang in a tank unless it's a small tank. Initially just keeping two one most likely will bully the other killing it eventially and a group of Purple and/or Yellow Tangs have a very good chance of a pair forming and when that happens they will kill off the rest. I don't have a problem putting a group of 2" - 4" TL in a 55-75 gal. tank because I can relatively easily catch them when I need to take them out. For me the risk/benefit of green brittle stars is preferable to the risk/benefit of a group of Yellow and/or Purple Tangs. (here's a link to a video of a green brittle star "carressing" a fish but not trying to catch it: ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+etannert Posted July 15, 2012 Share Posted July 15, 2012 I recently got a Masked Rabbitfish and man, is that thing an algae eating machine! I don't have much algae in my tank so I feed about 1/4 of a sheet of nori a day (he is 3-4"). It is definitely a risk I took, putting a rabbitfish in a zoa/LPS dominant tank, but so far the only thing he's nibbled a little is one green mushroom that is near the only small patch of green turf algae in the tank. I sort of hope he takes a liking to the purple mushrooms too... Rabbitfish eat bubble algae and bryopsis too, so definitely a fish with a purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.