pompouslyours Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Hey guys and gals, first of all i inherited this tank a few monthes ago and am thouroughly enjoying the new hobby. And now, Im experiencing my first sick crab/fish. Ill generally describe my tank, i have two 60 gallon (one refugium) lots of live rock and sponges. Ive added a pygmy angel, box, cow, and the arrow crab. There was a chomis and mandarin all in the tank already. All of which are doing fine. Really good actually, the only one effected is the arrow crab. I also have a few star, corals, and healthy aninemie. any suggestions? the ph is normal btw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mFrame Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 What's the issue with the crab? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonSequitur Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 Please describe the symptoms you're seeing in your arrow crab. Also, if you can, please post your last salinity, ammonia, nitrate, nitrite, ph, and alkalinity test results (or as many of them as you can (numbers please, they help more than "normal")). Any changes to the tank? What is your water change schedule? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 ok, this tank was given to me by a friend, who has described it as a tidal reef system, i add fresh water twice dailey and have been instructed to virtually never change the water. I do not have testing supplys but plan on going to aquadome in a minute to check alk and nitrates. the ph test i have is a bobber with a green strip. The strip is right where it needs to be ( and has been) sorry if the description is general, im trying. the crab is kinda in free float on top of some sponges, he was not moving at all and things were building up on him. As i have noticed over the month i have had him, he never allows this to happen. well, i thought he was dead and was gonna scoop him out when he moved. I decided to try and feed the tank, (frozen shrimp cube) which he normally will react to. Today he still did not move, he is alive but he seems paralyzed. the anineme has been trying to move alot lately, seems like he is also uncomcoftable, since ive had the tank he would inflate and deflate regularly. He has been filling himself with water and trying to move, the crab and the aninemie are in the same corner (if that helps) I will check the bobber for a level and respond, once again iam new to this and want to be as helpful as i can thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 the bobber reads 1.1020 and sits just below this mark. also the crab seems to be perking up a bit and possibly cleaning himself. but still not much movement and some arms seem to just dangle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 ok i have the results ammonia 0ppm nitrate 0ppm nitrite 0 ppm ph 8.5-8.7 salinity 1.020 the most recent additions have been the cow (or bull, im not too sure) fish and a brittle star. this was about two weeks ago. before that it was the arrow crab, a fire shrimp, and box fish. the tank already had pleanty of other crabs and snails, aninomeas, spnges, corals, live rocks, a nother star, mandarin, chromis, other life... anything else i can provide, i will do the best i can thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GKarshens Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 Your salinity is a bit low. 1.025 is what is generally accepted. Also your PH is a bit high. You want it to be around 8.3. Neither of those seem far enough out of whack to bother the crab though. I am not sure why you would be instructed to never do water changes. Somehow you will need to export built up nutrients. You also will need to add trace minerals that get used up. Both of these are achieved in water changes. I would suggest starting with 20% monthly. One thing not generally tested but I know will affect inverts like crabs is copper. It is a great idea to have a full set of test kits around. Especially when you are starting out. It helps you get to know your tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 alright, ill check for copper. how do i lower the ph? i know acids are available but something tells me that can be dangerous? also, would adding a little salt to the fresh water be a good idea? Ive noticed the box fish trying to eat the disabled crab. My friend that gave me the tank has had it for 4-5 years, rarely changing the water, he tells me its full of natural cleaners and spnges which take care of everything. I add fresh water every two or three days, keeping the sump at about 80%. I will be doing a 20% change from now on though, also to learn i guess. thanks again, im excited about the new hobby and you will definitly be hearing from me. I will keep you posted on the crab Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 ok just noticed the fire shrimp is dead. is there anyway i can check on the star fish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 both star fish are moving around. In fact, everything is moving around as usual. Both crustacians might have had it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GKarshens Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 I would go ahead and start getting some water ready for a water change. It seems odd that some animals are having issues while others are not. If there is a bad chemical or other agent in there that is affecting them at least a water change will dilute it. Many of the LFS have premixed water you can buy. Or you can buy salt and make water yourself. Only I would not use tap water. RO/DI is best since it pulls all the minerals and chemicals out of the tap water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesL Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 It could be possible the Arrow Crab is getting ready to molt (shed it's skin). Crabs do this in order to grow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 i would agree but both molted at the same time, about two weeks ago. im not sure if the fire shrimp just died or has been dead. he often hides behind some rock. All together the tank is very lively. i will work on the ph, and see what time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mFrame Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 If you have hermits then he must have just died. Between them and the brittle stars something dead won't last long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddybluewater Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 I wouldn't do a 20% change for your first one. I would suggest 10% a week for the first 2 weeks and then get on at least 10% every other week schedule. If you have not been doing changes a sudden change in the system might cause problems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 for sure, i feel more comfortable with a 10% change, I have an emerald and several hermits. so i bet it was recently. i mixed half a lemon in fresh water and added it to the refugium tank. Honestly, ive been browsing the forums, and i dont know the difference between a refugium or a sump. Or what i have. Basically, the show tank is on top, i have a pump in the bottom tank (both about the same 50-55 gal) pumping water to the top. and a siphon and valve siphoning water to the bottom. In both tanks i have seperate pumps with air hoses pumping water around the tanks. Like i said, its been living for years this way, and everything has been a ok till today. Anyways, i have added half a lemon to a gallon of frsh water and have slowley been adding it to the bottom tank. i will double check all the levels in a few hours Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 12, 2009 Author Share Posted November 12, 2009 ive balanced the ph to about 8. everything else is still good. I will see tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddybluewater Posted November 12, 2009 Share Posted November 12, 2009 When you do water changes you need to work with the total water volume so your 10% changes, from what you have described would be 10 gallons. A sump is just extra water and a place to put other filtration, IE. a skimmer or reactors. Arefugium is a section to grow macro algae and some people use them for a Deep Sand Bed (dsb) if they do not have one in the display. If you do not have a protien skimmer it is highy recomended that 50% per week water changes be done. This will remove the waste that would other wise be removed by skimming. I feel that a good skimmer is one of the most important parts of any system. I highly recomend Coralvue's Octopus skimmers they (IMO) are the best for the money. For 100g total water volume you should look at a skimmer rated for around 150g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pompouslyours Posted November 15, 2009 Author Share Posted November 15, 2009 well ive been monitering the situation. Im starting to think the two recent deaths are unrelated. First i lost the fire shrimp, but i had put him in the bottom tank, not thinking about the light being possibley too close (plus it was on for 24 hours) I think his death had something to do with that. Next the arrow crab has been appearing to be dead for a few days now. He has been in a state of paralysis, i have been making sure food gets close enough for him to grab without effort. Today he seems to be doing the best, he has moved to the other end of the tank> His legs appear to be regaining movement, but his head and arms are leaning down ( he kinda seems drunk) anyways i will keep monitoring and hope for the best. The water's ph, salinity, nitrates/nitrites and ammonia have been checked and all within range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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