Tank at 2.5 months

[dweyant]

So, it has been a very eventful 2.5 months for our tank, but it seems to finally be settling in.

The adventure with the heater made things quite "interesting", but thanks to some folks here we have mostly recovered from that. Marineland has been responsive, and has agreed to pay for our losses and expenses, so I have to give them credit for that.

Anyway, it looks like things are working well, all parameters are normal, everyone looks happy, is eating etc.

We currently have a Skunk cleaner (only thing other than the snails to survive the great heater explosion, so he is hearty), a yellow clown goby, a McCoskers(sp?) Wrasse, and a O. Clown. Plus about 30 assorted snails (margarita, Nasarius, etc.)

75 gallon tank, 20 gallon sump, currently two 36 inch T5 lights, but looking to upgrade to 4 48 inch VHO lights soon.

I do have a couple questions.

1) The skimmer is still not doing much. It will occasionally produce a little skimmate, but not much, and I can't get it adjusted to do anything consistantly. Is that just because I still have a pretty light bio-load, or do I need to do something?

2) We are still fighting a bit of algae. Nothing major, but I'd like to do/get something to make sure it doesn't get out of hand. Suggestions? Is it time for some crabs?

3) What should we look at getting next? I'd like to add a Hippo Tang at some point, and I'd really like a Mandarian somewhere down the road (I know that tank likely won't be ready for that for some time still).

Any thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.

-Dan

[GKarshens]

unfortunately a 75 is too small for a Hippo and a mandarin. The Tang needs at least a 6' tank. They get over a foot long. If you don't believe me go check out melevsreef.com and see the video of the Hippo he used to have in his 280g. The Mandarin will need at least 100 lbs of live rock unless you get very lucky and find one that will eat prepared food. Those are very rare though. I had one starve in a 125.

[dweyant]

unfortunately a 75 is too small for a Hippo and a mandarin. The Tang needs at least a 6' tank. They get over a foot long. If you don't believe me go check out melevsreef.com and see the video of the Hippo he used to have in his 280g. The Mandarin will need at least 100 lbs of live rock unless you get very lucky and find one that will eat prepared food. Those are very rare though. I had one starve in a 125.

Wow, didn't realize that about the Hippo, glad I asked.

I've got about 130 pounds of live rock now, and I figure I'll add a bit more as I find good deals and/or pieces that are interesting. Should that be enough live rock for a Mandarin?

If not a hippo what else would you suggest? I was also thinking about maybe some frogspawn as an easy starter coral.

-Dan

[GKarshens]

The only Tangs that might work in a 75 would be of the Bristle Tooth variety (Kole Eyes, Tomini) I am a big fan of Fairy Wrasses, but if you are determined to get a Mandarin, they will compete for pods.

Frogspawn is a good beginner coral. They are relatively easy and don't over grow like Xenia or mushrooms.

[cardsfan12]

I had a hippo tang in a 55 for 4 years until I lost it when I had to move the tank. It started out about the size of a quarter and within 5 months it was about 7 inches long and fat. It stayed about that size until, well, it died in the move. At one of the LFS I used to go to, in the display tank, they had one again about the size of a quarter that never really grew much. After years it maybe grew to be 2 inches. I always assumed he was replacing it, but after talking to the owner he was as puzzled by this as I was. My theory is the arrangement of the rocks is the determining facter in how much size the tangs will gain. In my tank I had many large caves and over hangs along with plenty of room to swim, where as in the LFS the rocks were piled in there with lots of little caves and holes. I think that tangs will not outgrow their environment. Not saying that you should throw one into a 20 gallon tank, but I do think that a 75 should be fine. I haven't done much reading on the hippo tang since I got into the hobby about five years ago, but I read up on them prior to getting one myself and everything I read said they would be fine in a 55, so in my opinion your tank should suffice. I also had a mandarin dragonet in there that dip well, but I would definatly make sure your tank is in great shape first.

As far as algae, I hope you don't have hair algae and if you do nip it in the butt early. I battled that stuff in my old tank. Pain in the butt! lawn mower blennies will eat it when it is "new", but once it is long and established the lawnmower blennys seem to ignor it. I read somewhere that it has a bitter taste to it when longer that the lawnmowers don't like. Not sure how they determined how it taste, thats just what I read. Lettuce nudibraches will go to town on it for a while, but they typically aren't long lived in the home aquarium. No matter what kind of algae you have, I would stock up on hermit crabs and other "janitors". It seems like half the living things in my 140 gallon reef are there because of their functionality, not for their looks(even though most of them look pretty cool too). So I suggest you research your individual problems and see if there is a natural solution, but make sure the critter you add isn't going to turn into another problem down the road.

Oh I just thought about my diadema sea urchin. This guy goes to town on my rocks, scraping it clean of all algae in its path. Unfotunatly it eats the good coaline algaes too, but you win some you loose some. If I could go back I would have gotten a small one(yeah I know eventually it will get big) to slow his progress.

Anyway to sum up this long winded post. Research everything you ever put into your tank and never impulse buy. Sorry I didn't give you any sources for the info I gave you.

[Captain Vash]

2) We are still fighting a bit of algae. Nothing major, but I'd like to do/get something to make sure it doesn't get out of hand. Suggestions? Is it time for some crabs?

Sea Hares are amazing at eating any kind of algae.

[Rjohn]

You asked about your skimmer. Do you have an auto-topoff system? If not, then a skimmer will never work correctly. The ever changing water level will continually throw your skimmer out of it's optimum setting. I had this problem for quite a while. Auto topoff systems are not very expensive. They can be considerably less than $100. See Http://www.autopoff.com or http://www.aquahub.com.

[JamesL]

2.5 months for a tank is still a very young tank. As the tank matures, most of the nuisance algae will go away on it's own (with some help of a clean up crew)... that is unless you are adding in a source of phosphate for the algae to eat (tap water, over feeding, etc).

[dweyant]

You asked about your skimmer. Do you have an auto-topoff system? If not, then a skimmer will never work correctly. The ever changing water level will continually throw your skimmer out of it's optimum setting. I had this problem for quite a while. Auto topoff systems are not very expensive. They can be considerably less than $100. See Http://www.autopoff.com or http://www.aquahub.com.

Hmm, didn't realize that, but it makes sense I guess. I seem to loose about 1/2 - 3/4 inch a day in my sump. I was thinking about doing an ATO, I guess I need to up it on the priority list.

I just got one of the reefkeeper lite systems. They sell an dual switch ATO that I might have to look at getting.

-Dan

[joshman1204]

Getting an ato should be the number one priority for any reef tank. I put off getting one for several months and after getting one I will never run a tank without one

[GKarshens]

I had a hippo tang in a 55 for 4 years until I lost it when I had to move the tank. It started out about the size of a quarter and within 5 months it was about 7 inches long and fat. It stayed about that size until, well, it died in the move. At one of the LFS I used to go to, in the display tank, they had one again about the size of a quarter that never really grew much. After years it maybe grew to be 2 inches. I always assumed he was replacing it, but after talking to the owner he was as puzzled by this as I was. My theory is the arrangement of the rocks is the determining facter in how much size the tangs will gain. In my tank I had many large caves and over hangs along with plenty of room to swim, where as in the LFS the rocks were piled in there with lots of little caves and holes. I think that tangs will not outgrow their environment. Not saying that you should throw one into a 20 gallon tank, but I do think that a 75 should be fine. I haven't done much reading on the hippo tang since I got into the hobby about five years ago, but I read up on them prior to getting one myself and everything I read said they would be fine in a 55, so in my opinion your tank should suffice.

I am sorry, but this is just plain bad advice. I would think your own experience with the Hippo would tell you otherwise. It is a common misconception that fish grow to the size of their tank. A Hippo Tang in the wild swims long distances. If we keep them in small tanks it is similar to keeping a horse in a small paddock and never exercising it. It gets stressed and eventually dies an early death. I have seen a 2" Yellow Tang pace nonstop in a 55g. Ever notice that the Tangs in the holding tanks at fish stores are constantly swimming back and forth? The fish doesn't know he is little and you plain to move him to a larger tank when he outgrows yours. There are so many other fish choices other than Tangs. I don't understand why everyone wants one no matter the size of their tank. I know this is a bit of a strong reply, but I am so tired of fish being needlessly put into systems that cannot support them long term.

[cardsfan12]

I am sorry, but this is just plain bad advice. I would think your own experience with the Hippo would tell you otherwise. It is a common misconception that fish grow to the size of their tank. A Hippo Tang in the wild swims long distances. If we keep them in small tanks it is similar to keeping a horse in a small paddock and never exercising it. It gets stressed and eventually dies an early death. I have seen a 2" Yellow Tang pace nonstop in a 55g. Ever notice that the Tangs in the holding tanks at fish stores are constantly swimming back and forth? The fish doesn't know he is little and you plain to move him to a larger tank when he outgrows yours. There are so many other fish choices other than Tangs. I don't understand why everyone wants one no matter the size of their tank. I know this is a bit of a strong reply, but I am so tired of fish being needlessly put into systems that cannot support them long term.

Ehh...seems I pushed a button or two. Sorry, just going off of personal experience and it was just a theory to explain why the one fish never gained in size, while the other grew quite large in a shorter time period(the large one leveled off in size after just 5 or 6 months while I never saw the small one gain much size at all). The hippo tang at the fish shop I work at, they had for 15 years never reached the "max size" and was 6 maybe 7 inches long. If you look at most online dealers They will give you a minimum tank size. I just googled it and checked the first three or four I saw. The minimum tank sizes noted are 55 and 75 gallons(have to take this with a grain of salt because they are trying to sell you stuff on these sites). Anyway, I see the point GKarshens is making. Basically, when you are setting up your tank you are basically trying to replicate the inhabitants natural environment. So more swimming room would be better for a fish that has the potential to grow fairly large. Unfortunatly I think very few fish in captivity grow to their maximum size. I don't think you should go into it thinking that the fish will die before it outgrows your tank, but I do think that if you keep this fish for many years and it eventually does out grow your tank then you will either be so addicted to this hobby(like most of us are) and be more than ready to upgrade to a larger tank or you can sell a "Show fish" of that size off and at the very least be able to replace it for another juvenile if not a nice chunk of change(Show fish can be very valuable). I wouldn't hesitate to place a hippo tang into a 75 gallon tank, but you should do your own research(this forum is part of that) and make an educated decision that you are comfortable with. The great thing about a forum like this is you can soak up other peoples experiences and see their differences in opinion and make the best decision that works for you.

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

I've seen several people keep tangs in smaller tanks when the fish are small. It's hard to say if the fish is happy.

I tend to over research things and gkarshens is right. Most reputable online sites will list a 100g+ tank for tangs.

I have a little 2" yellow tang in my 125g. It really isn't that active of a fish. I could easily see keeping one that size in a 75g with the understanding that as the fish matures you may need to rehome it.

I really want a blue hippo as well but have mixed feelings about whether it would be overstocking my tank. I already have the yellow tang, 2 chromis, a Pygmy angel and an ocellaris clown (planning to add another ocellaris soon)