night time creepy crawlies

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

Ok, I need thoughts from those of you who have been doing this for a while. I checked the tank a few hours after lights out last night with a flash light which is always fun. Saw a few more things than normal and I'm wondering if any of them will have the potential to become problamatic.

First- giant bristle worm! I've read a lot about these guys. I like having the little ones, but this guy was BIG. Looked like this one: http://www.melevsreef.com/id/bristleworm.html which Melev says is fine, but frankly a 6"+ long worm in my tank is still freaking me out a little. I lost a clown very mysteriously a couple weeks ago. He was perfectly healthy, then one morning he was having a hard time swimming (was laying in the hairy mushrooms where the clowns host) and was breathing fast. Died by afternoon. I checked him over and he had what looked like a few sting marks on his belly. I blamed it on a couple of the new more agressive corals I'd just added to the tank (frogspawn and galaxea) but didn't really think that made sense. After all, plenty of stories of clowns hosting in such things. Now I'm wondering about this giant bristle worm! I've seen it twice in the area right next to the clowns mushrooms. All that said, my big female clown has been fine in my tank for 5+ months and I haven't lost any of my other fish.

Second- limpets! Bunches of mostly white ones. Just on the rock and film algae on the back of the tank. Didn't see a single one on any of my corals. Not sure where these guys came from but their population is increasing for sure.

Third- chitons, bright pink ones!? They're little, just over 1/4". Again, just on the rock and not on any of the corals.

Fourth- very weird thing I'm not sure I can even describe well enough for an ID. It's living in a hole in the rock. About 1/2" of the creature is always visible in it's closed position. While closed it looks a little like a chiton with a slightly pointier head. It's grey and kinda plated looking. However, it can fling it's head (?) back at which point it has a series of gills (looks kinda like a car air fiter) and appears to be filter feeding! It hasn't moved since I first saw it. No shell or other covering visible. It doesn't like light and very quickly clamps closed.

My amphipod/copepod population is also insane. They are EVERYWHERE in the tank. Lots of little things swirling in the water attracted to the flashlight beam as well. I guess that explains why my mandarin is looking so fat and happy. I know my cleaner shrimp have spawned a couple times recently. Mmm... shrimpy snacks for the tank.

I keep saying it, but the diversity of life in my tank just amazes me!

[Timfish]

I doubt the bristle worm caused the problem with the clown (about 95% sure). I've found much bigger ones than that over the years in tanks that were doing well and not had any recent history of unexplained deaths. The little limpets and chitons are very good scavangers and algae eaters. The limpets I hear people having issues with are the larger ones with black or yellow mantles. That last one sounds really cool can you post pictures of it?

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

Thanks Tim, puts my mind to rest a little about the bristle worm. I don't know how I'd even go about getting it out, so I guess for now I'll just leave it. Man it was creepy looking!

Awesome about the limpets and chitons. No wonder every little bit of algae in my tank is disapearing. What happens when I don't have any macro left in the tank? Will I have a mass die off of little hitch hikers?

I wish I could get a pic of the last critter. My camera disappeared while I was on vacation a couple months ago and I haven't had a chance to replace it yet. I'm hunting around online trying to find this thing and I'm having no luck at all.

Do you have any other ideas about what could have killed the clown? He went from seeming perfectly fine for a couple weeks, fine the evening before then failing the next morning and dead by afternoon. The only physical sign of a problem were a few small slightly raised white welts on his belly. Did not look/seem like ich, and none of my other fish including my tang had spots. I bought another clown to replace him, but the fish was horribly stressed when I put it in the tank. Paced and paced and paced against the side panel of the tank, wouldn't stop to eat, wasn't interested in my big female clown who was very interested in him. It died in less than 12 hours, no signs of trama... found him sucked into the intake of a powerhead. I attributed that to not transitining well into captiviy/shipping stress. All my other fish are fine, no losses. I'm getting very frustrated with my inability to find a long term mate for my female clown. Just doesn't make sense when the rest of the tank is so healthy.

[Timfish]

My belief is marks like that on a fish especially if it's died could just as easily be bacterial or some kind of internal thing as caused by something stinging it or attacking it or maybe something "tasting" it after it's died. Sorry to hear about your new clown also If I have a fish die within a day or two I'm inclined to think it's from stress and maybe some unseen problem it already had, not neccessarily something wrong with my tank. Remember they have all the same problems we have and just like it can take weeks or months or years for symptoms to show with our diseases it can take a long time with fish too. That most of your animals in the tank are doing well argues it's not something fundamentally wrong with your tank or what with what your doing. And it could be your other clown is a black widow

I find those little limpets in sumps that don't get any light so they must be able to feed off the bacterial films and stuff besides just algae. Since they are "naturally" reproducing in your tank I would think the population would increase to a point were it's balanced with the available food. Not die off like you would see if you added a bunch of snails that consumed the food supply quickly then starved.

Edited May 24, 2010 by Timfish

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

I pulled the clown out of the tank and put him in a small container in my sump when I realized he wasn't doing well. So, nothing munched on him after death. I didn't notice any marks on him when I pulled him out of the tank, it was several hours later when he finally died that the marks were evident. He was acting like he had a neurological problem. Was swimming very erratically, then would rest on the bottom of the tank panting. I suppose it will go into the unsolved mysteries file, but it still bothers me. I got him from another reefer and he was doing great, then boom... dead. You are very right though that there's just no way to tell if the fish has something wrong with it that we can't see. It was a very small/young clown and I don't know how long his previous owner had had him. I just hate loosing animals, even fish.

I too believe the second clown loss was stress related. It was a new shipment of fish at the LFS, then the drive to my place and a new tank. It was just too much for him. Poor little guy.

It makes me feel horrible though. I hate seeing the loss of life in this hobby. I have a very hard time reconciling my desire to have these beautiful animals with the knowledge that so, so many die. The guilt is starting to build up. Especially when I'm killing clowns, I mean it's a stinkin' damsel. How am I killing the hardy fish and yet my tang & angel are healthy as a horse and happily swimming around? I've had several people tell me that you just have to grow a tough skin and anticipate losses. I guess I'm far enough into this venture now that I'm seeing the losses. *sigh*

I have a ton of spiorbid worms in my sump & fuge and now that you mention it some of the limpets as well. I guess there's plenty for everyone to eat. I doubt my tank will ever be clean enough that they'll all starve.

[Timfish]

. . . I just hate loosing animals, even fish. . . I've had several people tell me that you just have to grow a tough skin and anticipate losses.

It bothers me to loose fish also, sometimes alot. Unfortunately the one guaranty is every fish we put in a tank will die. One of the facts I use to console/justify doing this is from what I've found fish live MUCH longer in captivity than in the wild. (This is true with most species, better diet, health care and fewer predators.) There is some research indicating that the larva of some species require the absence of adults to complete metamorphoses and settle out of the plankton so removing an adult may allow one or more larva to survive. When done right these tanks are beautiful living works of art.

When I look at how far we've come since I set up my first saltwater in '88 I am truly amazed. No one had captive raised fish, Xenia was considered impossible to keep and most hobbyest were shooting in the dark guessing what the lighting requirements were for the wild corals they were buying. Directly or indirectly because we are setting up tanks and buying stuff and unfortunately killing stuff off we've created the means and motivation for companies and scientist to do research and figure out what needs to be done to keep this stuff alive and healthy. Now a tank can be set up COMPLETELY with captive raised fish and corals. There is also a real possibility we have created gene pools that maybe critical to the survival of some species. I don't like seeing fish die and sometimes it looks like they've died a very miserable death but when I look at how far we've come it's not going to stop me from continuing knowing one way or another I'm killing fish hopefully most will be from old age.