gordon12345 Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 (edited) I bought some fiji rock, zoas, frogspawn, snails, and crabs from aquadome last weekend ( http://www.austinree...-zoa-frogspawn/ ), within 24 hours my red zoa colony ($39!) was covered in a white film and dying. I've spent all week researching the possible cause (LED lighting, water params, etc). My tank is in perfect condition, KH, GH, PH, CA, temp, all perfect. I just came across this thread: http://webcache.goog...n&ct=clnk&gl=us which lead to this page of predators: http://www.coralpedi...2&g2_itemId=384 which I found this "sundial snail" on: http://www.coralpedi...2&g2_itemId=424 The guy that pulled my Zoas also selected my snails for me (heck I don't know anything about snails), and this was one of them (see pic below). is it a sundial snail? (it's about the size of quarter, or maybe a tad smaller) Did it kill my Zoa? What should I do with the snail? Don't get me wrong, I like the people at aquadome I previously bought my chili coral and a couple of other pieces there and always like browsing. But I wish they or I had known about this snail issue . Edited October 28, 2011 by gordon12345 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad and Jen May Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 I got a few of these snails from aquadome as well... all my zoos are fine..??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Well sure it looks like one.... But then again it looks like a hundred other types of snails. Tell me it's not this Caribbean Nerite smail Is it a small Trochus that has not grown out a tall spiral, And then with like so many other things in this hobby, it might be time to back off from the fine folks at the Dome and stop pointing the finger. As a consumer you share at least 50% of the blame. I don't care if you say "well I'm new to the hobby", that's not an excuse. I can remember way back when..... I just finished paying off our truck and was waiting to make a left hand turn a block from the house when I was suddenly rear ended at 50mph. I get out and it's 2 16 year old girls. Behind them was her Dad. He got out and told me to chill, she was driving home with her friend from the DMV where she just got her license. She told him they were "jamming out to a song and didn't see me or my turn signal". Dad told me to "chalk it up to inexperience"...... WTF!!?? Seriously? So I'm supposed to just take it because of someone's lack of experience? So what am I on about? It is up to you to make sure every purchase will work in your tnak. Mistakes do happen and with so many creatures looking alike it can be very difficult to ID 100% hence all the threads on this forum asking "Please ID this thingy for me".. Also back up a minute and stop blaming the store.... There is a very good chance that the small snail came in on your initial rock work, known as a "hitchhiker" Please search previous threads and/or use your GoogleFu skills to read up on this everyday occurrence. It may have even been stashed away in the zoa rock and YOU failed to see it and properly dispose of it before placing it in your tnak. Also known as "quarantining" What is quarantining my new hobbyist with the lack of experience, it's this process of holding new corals and fish in another smaller tnak so that if there is a problem it can be identified before placing the new specimen within the display tnak where it can wreak untold havoc on the entire system. What you say, and I'm still not finished. Back up yet again from blaming the store.... You say the zoa slimed over completely within a short period and then died off. Zoas do that. Google it, search function it. All kinds of corals will slime up, turn white before dying, and then be seen covered in snails or hermits. They are eating the detritus just as a good clean up crew should. Am I saying out loud that there is a possibility that for some unknown reason your water did not match the ideal conditions for that particular coral and it just up and died? What? In this hobby? Of course I am. I've spent countless dollars over the years watching a new specimen melt away shortly after placing the coral in the tnak. So keep in mind that the Dome is actually your friend, however if you come online and hint around that they dealt you a wrong blow, they may not care to help you in the future. Hunter, Gary and Terry have been in the hobby for a combined total of about 940 years, give or take, and are really great people. If a mistake was made, take it up with them, not here on the forum. If they dealt you a wrong blow by telling you off in the store, scammed you at the register etc, then by all means call a shop out, however there are way to many variables in the hobby to go around trying to lay blame online for a purchase YOU made and failed to quarantine. Can you tell, from a picture, the difference between the snails I posted and the snail you posted? Probably not. Do Doctors sometime see similar symptoms and occasionally misdiagnose something? To be 100% sure all the time is not human, as the saying goes "to err is human". I'm not just sticking up for the Dome, I'd do that for any shop you called out as you did in this post. This would not be the fault of any shop. The real issue here is simple "Is this a Sundial Snail? Did this snail eat my new zoas? If this is a Sundial Snail, what should I do now?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon12345 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 (edited) I don't know if you have some mental issues, are just a keyboard warrior in general but wow, way to go off on a rant like a complete *******. Like I said in my first post: Don't get me wrong, I like the people at aquadome I previously bought my chili coral and a couple of other pieces there and always like browsing. But I wish they or I had known about this snail issue . Did I blame anyone? No, I didn't so pull the stick out of your ***, and calm down. I clearly stated my lack of knowledge on the matter...which is why...... I asked three questions, because I'm looking for help. is it a sundial snail? (it's about the size of quarter, or maybe a tad smaller) Did it kill my Zoa? What should I do with the snail? Also like I said, I've spent all week researching the possible cause (LED lighting, water params, etc). My tank is in perfect condition, KH, GH, PH, CA, temp, all perfect. So yes, I have been googling it. I've been keeping fish for about 10 years, I'm not a retard. I asked on a forum about this because it's unusual behavior which doesnt match the 2-10 days degradation of zoas that I see online. My feeling was that the rate of "slime/white foam" was way too fast (overnight) to be degradation from anything other than a physical attack on the coral. I woke up the next morning with film/slime covering it. But again, this is why I'm here asking questions trying to eliminate all causes and become a better aquarist. Also back up a minute and stop blaming the store.... There is a very good chance that the small snail came in on your initial rock work, known as a "hitchhiker" Please search previous threads and/or use your GoogleFu skills to read up on this everyday occurrence. It may have even been stashed away in the zoa rock and YOU failed to see it and properly dispose of it before placing it in your tnak. Also known as "quarantining" What is quarantining my new hobbyist with the lack of experience, it's this process of holding new corals and fish in another smaller tnak so that if there is a problem it can be identified before placing the new specimen within the display tnak where it can wreak untold havoc on the entire system. What you say, and I'm still not finished. Back up yet again from blaming the store.... You say the zoa slimed over completely within a short period and then died off. Zoas do that. Google it, search function it. All kinds of corals will slime up, turn white before dying, and then be seen covered in snails or hermits. They are eating the detritus just as a good clean up crew should. Am I saying out loud that there is a possibility that for some unknown reason your water did not match the ideal conditions for that particular coral and it just up and died? What? In this hobby? Of course I am. I've spent countless dollars over the years watching a new specimen melt away shortly after placing the coral in the tnak. So keep in mind that the Dome is actually your friend, however if you come online and hint around that they dealt you a wrong blow, they may not care to help you in the future. Hunter, Gary and Terry have been in the hobby for a combined total of about 940 years, give or take, and are really great people. If a mistake was made, take it up with them, not here on the forum. If they dealt you a wrong blow by telling you off in the store, scammed you at the register etc, then by all means call a shop out, however there are way to many variables in the hobby to go around trying to lay blame online for a purchase YOU made and failed to quarantine. Can you tell, from a picture, the difference between the snails I posted and the snail you posted? Probably not. Do Doctors sometime see similar symptoms and occasionally misdiagnose something? To be 100% sure all the time is not human, as the saying goes "to err is human". I'm not just sticking up for the Dome, I'd do that for any shop you called out as you did in this post. This would not be the fault of any shop. The real issue here is simple "Is this a Sundial Snail? Did this snail eat my new zoas? If this is a Sundial Snail, what should I do now?" Again, I never claimed to be an expert. I never blamed the dome. All I asked was my three questions and stated that I could use some help because I'm not familiar with snails. Edited October 28, 2011 by gordon12345 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon12345 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 I got a few of these snails from aquadome as well... all my zoos are fine..??? Thanks, yeah I'm not sure if this is a sundial snail, or if he is bad. I guess I may release him back in the tank and keep an eye on the other Zoas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad and Jen May Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 I think what you have is a Trochus, as was mentioned above. I believe thats what mine are, and since we got them at the same place, thats probably the case. My experiences with the Dome have all been good. They are very knowledgeable and helpful and I personally dont believe they would ever sell you a creature that would damage your corals, especially since they sold you the zoas in the same purchase as the snails. I once bought a patch of palys from one of the LFS... I acclimated them to my DT tank water, then treated them with Coral rx, then put them in the DT. They looked fine, fully opening within an hour of placing them in my tank. The next morning however, they were completely melting away and I lost the entire colony in 48 hours. It happens sometimes. Dont know why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+KimP Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 I have 3 of those snails. I'm not sure of the name but I love those guys! Hard workers and live forever. I've had mine at least 2 or 3 years. I've never seen them hurt a thing. And there's no way anyone at the dome would've outright sold you a bad snail. They really do know about pests. I hope your zoas recover and grow back. I have about 50/50 luck with zoas growing vs.melting or staying closed up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon12345 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 (edited) ^ thanks to you both. That sounds right then, this probably isn't a sundial. Just also read that sundial snails move with their shell perpendicular to the ground and mine isn't doing that: http://www.reefcentr...&postid=5245201 On separate note: I've been using lugols solution to dip, but I'll check out CoralRX. I've put him back in the tank Appreciate the quick help with the ID and advice. Edited October 28, 2011 by gordon12345 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents worth. First, I'm pretty sure Gary accounts for about 900 years, not to detract from Terry and Hunter's experience but it seems reasonable to me that they only have about 20 years each, however, I haven't actually asked them and admittedly I could be off a couple years (just trying to look out for you Gary ). In my own experience it can take weeks or months from a stress event before a coral shows signs of a problem and not every coral may react the same way. This shouldn't stop us from looking at why a coral died and I like the process you went through Gordon to figure out why, just keep in mind a lot of the time especially with new corals we just may never know. (Here's a thread I posted awhile ago detailing a problem I had earlier this year with a frustrating problem with Fungia in one of my tanks: http://www.austinreefclub.com/topic/18681-inexplicable-fungia-sp-death/ .) I am really glad to see the discussion about parasite/preditors of coral and quarantining corals. As more and more people are growing thier own coral and swapping stuff this is unfortunately becoming more of a problem. Used to be all I worried about were mantis shrimp in live rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aqua-Dome Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Gordon, meet mike, austin reef club's resident (usually well-meaning) ranter. Now that you've had the trial by fire initiation, please feel free to call us if you ever have any questions. And yes, that is a trochus snail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caferacermike Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 By naming the store you purchased from and saying, I wish they had seen this, implies your blame. You may not see it that way but some of us reading your post might read it that way. Your post jumps to conclusion that this snail most likely is the problem and thus the problem came from the Dome. Again you may not see it that way since you wrote the post, however once read by others the pointy finger can be seen, I saw it that way. So if you feel it really was as sanitized as you claim, you wouldn't have named anyone as the source and you wouldn't have "wished" anything. Where I work we have a saying, "Wish in one hand, **it in the other and see which fills first". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon12345 Posted October 28, 2011 Author Share Posted October 28, 2011 I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents worth. First, I'm pretty sure Gary accounts for about 900 years, not to detract from Terry and Hunter's experience but it seems reasonable to me that they only have about 20 years each, however, I haven't actually asked them and admittedly I could be off a couple years (just trying to look out for you Gary ). In my own experience it can take weeks or months from a stress event before a coral shows signs of a problem and not every coral may react the same way. This shouldn't stop us from looking at why a coral died and I like the process you went through Gordon to figure out why, just keep in mind a lot of the time especially with new corals we just may never know. (Here's a thread I posted awhile ago detailing a problem I had earlier this year with a frustrating problem with Fungia in one of my tanks: http://www.austinree...ungia-sp-death/ .) I am really glad to see the discussion about parasite/preditors of coral and quarantining corals. As more and more people are growing thier own coral and swapping stuff this is unfortunately becoming more of a problem. Used to be all I worried about were mantis shrimp in live rock. Thanks timfish . I'll check out the link and read in full in a bit, just looked briefly. I've seen a lot of the same sort of stuff on the other reef forums this week while researching, so I guess it's not really a surprise that I lost one. I currently have 9 different ZOA colonies in the tank and never lost one (3 years), so 1 out of 10 sounds pretty good after reading those links with some even quoting "50/50 chance" with ZOAs. Gordon, meet mike, austin reef club's resident (usually well-meaning) ranter. Now that you've had the trial by fire initiation, please feel free to call us if you ever have any questions. And yes, that is a trochus snail. Thanks for the ID and advice offering, I always enjoy browsing your store Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
innate1 Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 Gordon I love zoa's. They sometimes melt for no known reason. One day fine, the next ????? Sad but true. To answer a few of your questions, yes Mike is mental. It's one of his most endearing qualities. He's also one hell of a nice guy. See how he stood up for the fine folks at the dome? It's what he does for friends and this club. Hang out long enough and you'll drink a beer with him and laugh over this. Sorry your zoas melted. It sucks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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