changing out a sandbed

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

I officially can not stand the crushed coral in my tank any longer! Man I hate that stuff.

I got some 'live' sand from Chris today (Ozarkwater), about 1/2 a 5g bucket full (thank you Chris! Oh, and little Mr Crab is now king of the fuge. He has 10g of all the pods or algae he wants to eat. I think he'll be happier in there than in the sump).

Because I'm paranoid I dumped off the water that was in the bucket, dumped the sand in a clean container and covered it with water from a water change I did today and put a couple airstones in to circulate the water. Gonna test parameters in the morning and check for ammonia and nitrites before I dump it in my tank. Yea... I do get the Mrs. Paranoia crown.

Anyway, I've read some on how to switch out a sand bed and there doesn't seem to be an easy way to do it. My thought is to start at one end of the tank, clear out a section of CC and then replace with sand. I don't see any way to avoid having some of the old CC mix in with the new sand. I don't mind as long as the end result is a sand bed that is predominantly sand. Will wet sand slide down a PVC pipe? I've seen it suggested to add new sand to a tank via a pipe which sounds like a great idea. Just not sure it'll work if the sand is wet. If I know ahead of time that's at least one mess I can avoid if it's not going to work.

How often should I add new sand to the tank? I don't want to make it cycle. I do have a lot of live rock and of course the remaining live 'sand' bed. I'm hoping that will help compensate as I switch things out.

If I get dry (dead) sand would it be worth putting it in a container with some water from a water change and letting it sit & circulate for a while before adding it to the tank?

I need a sand bed fairy godmother who can just 'poof' a pretty new sandbed into place while I'm asleep.

[Derek]

Sand will go down PVC. I used a piece of flex hosing when I added a new sand bed to my tank. I cut the top off of a coke bottle and used that as a funnel, then just put in the sand cup by cup.

[Rjohn]

Liz, why don't you start a blog with pictures so we can track your progress. I may be doing this as well in a few months so I'd like to learn from your experiences. What do you hate about the crushed coral bed? Mark Callahan also suggested that I just replace the CC outside the rock formation. That way I'd have a live sand bed surrounding the CC that is supporting my LR.

[+o0zarkawater]

Since I just picked up that Sand yesterday morning, I can't give much insight into it. I got it from August & Jake who said it was fully cycled for over a year. So it should be good to go.

I used the other half of the bucket in my bare 20gal tank. After the dust settled overnight I can see lots of little worm holes like you usually see up against the glass. So there are lots of good little critters in there. I have about 5 hermits and a dozen snails in the 20gal who are nice and happy today. They like their new sand. I haven't tested the water params, since this tank was set up as a QT tank for liverock. I only have a small filter and powerhead on it, and no actual fish in it.

I plan on moving my 10gal over to this 20gal in a month or so. I wanted the sand because I have CC in the 10gal and I don't like it. So I plan on moving over the rocks and fish only, none of the substrate.

I hope people can give you some good insight into the switch, and it works out well for you!

Edited March 15, 2010 by o0zarkawater

[JimD]

The problem isnt adding the new sand, its removing the old. If you attempt to remove the old sand while the tank is inhabited, there is a serious risk of a major cycle that could wipe out your tank. I would strongly suggest that you empty the tank, saving the water, then remove the old crushed coral and replacing it with the new sand.. Thus the reason for the no "easy way to do it"... Ive done it before in the past with no issues. The other possibility would be to remove a small ammout in weekly intervals. Good luck.

Edited March 15, 2010 by JimD

[Salt Dreams]

I just added sand to my tank and I used a small bucket and it was easy breezy...how the heck are you going to get all those little rocks out thats the question!!!

[Hamp]

I am super paranoid on this. I have done it in the past with bad results. I would transfer everything to a holding tank first. Then remove the sand from your tank. Rinse the new sand until the water is clean. Then let it dry a while spread out in the sun. Then put it in the new tank, and add back your LR and livestock. That's just me though.

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

Ric, are you trying to use me and my poor tank as a guinea pig? A blog would have been a good idea. Sadly my allergies are making me miserable and since the water params on the sand came back great I just wanted to get it in the tank ASAP while it was still live. I will share my process & progress though.

Chris, the sand (as far as I can tell!) is awesome. I found a tiny frag of zoas in it (that are already open) and a cool little snail is climbing up the glass in my tank... not one I've ever had before so I assume it came from the sand. All water params in the container where I had it tested perfect across the board (ammonia, nitrites, nitrates and phosphates). Thank you again.

Well, I had a lot more sand or maybe just a lot less actual 'floor' volume than I thought across the front of my tank. I do have a pretty good amount of rock. I ended up removing just over 1/2 a bucket of CC from the tank and replaced it with a slightly more shallow bed of sand (between 1/2-1", I may build it up a little more in spots eventually) that spans almost the entire front of the tank. More than I'd anticipated replacing, but I've taken a full 5g bucket of CC out of my tank at a time with no ill results so I'm not too concerned. Since the sand going in does seem to be fully cycled and live, I'm going to hope for the best and be happy I got so much done in a day. ** One note, since I was battling nutrient build up issues with this tank I had been doing deep siphoning of the CC bed to clean out old crud. It got fairly well rinsed when I moved the tank, but it was still kinda dirty. I'd also reduced the CC bed to less than an inch. If you have a deep or really dirty CC bed I suspect you might have more problems with releasing nasty stuff into the water column. When I was researching before doing this I read in several placed to deep clean the CC before removing it and in the case of a deep one to reduce the depth before finally taking it out.**

Removing the CC is very easy. I used (4th time around now I've done this, I've got the technique down) a small fish net. Scoop up a net full of CC, let small particle crud settle with the net low in the tank, lift it up and let the water drain a second then dump in a catch bucket. Easy removal that leaves most of the water in the tank. This only let me get to the CC in front of the rocks, the stuff behind/deep between the rocks is going to be more challenging. I did leave some of the CC around the rocks, no idea if it'll help with seeding or not, but it was easier to leave some than to try to remove it all.

Since the sand going in was wet it did not want to slide down a pipe (I tried a 5/8" flex tube with a funnel... it clogged too easily. A wider pipe and a DIY coke funnel might have worked better). However, since the sand was very wet it didn't float away much so I just scooped it up with a small cup and poured it out in the bottom of the tank. Easy enough. I'm going to have to get used to how sand swirls around. Nothing moved the CC... now I have sand blowing around from my powerheads. That's novel, for me.

The whole process did make a good sand storm in the tank, but neither my corals or fish are upset. A couple corals actually seem to me enjoying the mess (my candy canes have had their feeders out all day)! It's been about 4 hours now and there's a slight haze in the tank but you can see through it and the worst has already settled down.

I'm going to test water params tonight and in the morning. Thus far everything in the tank is doing great, no distress at all. I have 15g of saltwater made up in case I need to pull critters or do a water change, another 15 of DI water I can convert to salt in an emergency. Makes me feel a little better. I may just be in the calm before the storm (or crash), but it's been a few hours and all seems well so far. I'm keeping my fingers crossed

For the CC behind the rock... I think I will siphon it out a bit at a time during water changes and then try filling it back in with dry sand and tubing. That's going to be the harder part of the change to accomplish for sure.

Overall, I'm really happy. The sand looks *SO* much nicer. I mean wow... world of difference! Will update tomorrow on the condition of the critters in the tank.

[GKarshens]

I would measure your parameters everyday for at least a week. Usually disturbing sand bed will cause a cycle as the detritus that was trapped in the sand doesn't get enough oxygen to break down all the way. Once it is stirred it gets the oxygen it needs and starts to decay. Personally I feel sand is one of the cheapest parts of this hobby so I always start with new sand in a new tank. I will seed it with a cupful of my old live sand or from someone else. Or just let the live rock do it. In your case trying to get rid of CC you are more limited in your options. But I would be more concerned about the sand you are putting in causing a cycle than pulling the CC out. So like I said, monitor it closely.

[Rjohn]

Liz, I am not really using you as a guinea pig but I can always benefit by your experiences and hopefully avoid making dumb mistakes.

Question for the group: Will the sand being blown around by the powerheads eventually settle or will she need to re-direct the heads?

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

All is well this morning. Water params last night and this morning are good. Everything settled, the water is totally clear (was by lights out last night). The stuff swirling around settled down, there's a different pattern in the sand now so I guess it adjusted to my power heads. I'm getting new PHs this weekend, hopefully they won't blow the sand around too much.

Ric, I'm just teasing you. If anything I do helps you at all I'm pleased! My tank is just one long, ongoing science project anyway.

Gabriel, I've done major moves and stir ups of my CC sand bed a few times now (the biggest when I move the tank and stupidly put the CC back in... didn't know at the time it was not what I'd want to use), it never sent my tank into a cycle. I tested for the complete nitrogen cycle right after moving, never got an ammonia reading. Ditto the 3 other times I took out significant amounts of CC from the tank and exposed the underlayers. Now, I don't know if that's because CC doesn't compact the way sand does thus allowing better water circulation through the whole bed, or if I just got lucky! The live sand I put in my tank had also just been moved a couple times and I dumped it all into a container and poured new water over it. With that much stirring and moving I'd assume I would have seen some sign of a cycle, right? Ammonia or nitrites (I left it in a container overnight then tested the water the next morning)? I didn't so I'm going to assume (hope!) that it was truly live and cycled and good to go. I'm not arguing with you, just kinda questioning the 'Don't re-use sand' theory because I've seen good arguments for and against. I'm hoping I'll dodge the 'against' bullets. Oh... might also help that I have a good amount of rock.

Anyway, my next step is hopfully meeting Prof on Sat to get more sand, finishing off the sand bed on the front part of the tank then working on the back.

Here are a couple of pictures with the sand in. Not great pictures, my camera was dead this morning so I took these on my iPhone. One thing I've noticed is that the sand is so much brighter than the CC!

[Hamp]

Not to freak you out, but I have disturbed a CC bed that I decided to leave in the tank during a move....every thing seemed fine until the 4th day. Then BLOOOM... water went brown, fish died, lost a good bit of coral. I would be very careful, and be prepared to do major water changes if you need to. With that said, the tank looks great, and I hope that you avoid any problems!

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

Thanks for the warning Hamp. I am going to watch the tank closely. Will run water param checks again tonight.

Bummer on your tank crashing. Ouch. Did you have a lot of live rock?

I don't know why my tank didn't crash after the move (it's been 6 months now since moving it and its done nothing but improve). It was *so* neglected when I bought it. The CC bed was filthy, hair algae out the wazoo, massive nutrient build up (with high nitrates and phosphates). Maybe it was just so bad nothing could possibly make it worse!

Oh, and thank you for the compliment on the tank. It has come so far.

[GKarshens]

Like I said in my post I am more worried about the sand than the CC. Like Hamp said it will take a few days before it will show up. You might get lucky and have no issues. I would just keep testing daily for a while.

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

I will Gabriel and thank you for the heads up. I'll keep testing and watching. I mixed up more water so if things start to head downhill i will be ready.

[Rjohn]

Your tank looks very nice. When can you come do mine? BTW, what kind of powerheads are you getting?

[August]

I will say that the sand that you got that was originally mine had a sand sifting starfish, hermits, Nassarius snails, and other misc snails as well going through it 24/7 so it should be in good shape... never gave me any issues or anything. The sand is great just didnt need it anymore I am so glad that it is working out for others....

[+KeeperOfTheZoo]

Well,

All went totally well. No problems at all and I think I'm past the danger zone. Good sand.

I am now a HUGE fan of converting nasty old CC sand beds.

Just wish I was home to enjoy it. Currently in Mississippi en route to N Carolina for a family emergency. I hate leaving the tank.

I think I'm gonna sneak in a trip to Florida on the way home though!!

Ric, I'm gonna get Koralia 3s. I figured I'd start there and add more if needed. Gee, I'd love to help you change over your cc bed but I'm a couple states away! LOL! It's really pretty easy and so worth it.

[Rjohn]

Liz, I may have a couple of K-3's available next week. They are only a month old and I'll make you a deal.