jbharlan91

Yes, please bring the kids, Tyler has lots of things for kids to play with . The jumper will be up and of course the above ground pool is still up for cooling off. Please bring your own towels if you plan to get in the pool. We will also be doing hamburgers and hot dogs....please feel free to your chairs and whatever. Hope you all have good time.

That sounds awesome - thanks for including kids!! We'd love to come, can we bring food? Anything?

Welcome! Though that quote is a bit more fitting for leaving

Yeah, that's why I changed it to hello!!

Bad attempt at a Douglas Adams joke....

I'm new to ARC and saltwater tanks, but have already posted some questions and opinions on the site - and received a lot of help and some new corals and fish from ARC members! Just wanted to say thanks for the help, info and patience of those that have responded to my posts and questions, it really seems like a great site and resource so far!! Looking forward to a successful aquarium and eventually being able to share some of my stuff with others!!

My husband and I would love to come and check it out, we're very new and unfortunately don't have any frags to share, and we have an 11 year old that may or may not be interested in coming - would he be okay or is this better kidless?

We also like to ask tons of questions and pester people with them......

I'm a SeaAggie - graduated in 95. Or was it 96?? Been too long, I forget. I never made it up to the main campus though, spent all my time in Galveston. Actually the only one in my family that didn't go to UT!

Is Round Rock considered North Austin or Elsewhere? North of the river really isn't anywhere close to Round Rock......

Here's a link for a recipe to make a 10 dKH standard:

http://www.wamas.org...inity-standard/

Marine Depot, and most likely other suppliers, has Calcium, pH, and Nitrate calibration fluids. If a refractometer is calibrated correctly with distilled water it seems to me it wouldn't need to be verified with a sample of known salinity.

Besides using a standard of freshly mixed saltwater I'd still like to see water from a bunch of tanks checked as well. The results from the DFMAS tests suggests there may be processes in the tanks that might affect the tests. For example, the mean Alk for Pstleeb's tank was .59 dKH higher than AWT.com's results while the mean Alk for Davej was only .3. Why? The salinity was the same and as I understand the testing methodology they described there were multiple eyes verifying questionable interpretations of each test. It also seems to me if a sample of the freshly mixed saltwater is sent to AWT.com you'd have another standard to work with besides using calibration fluids or maybe send of a sample at the same time the tests are done and dispense with getting calibration fluids.

Timfish - I have all the equipment and supplies to do this, I could very easily make this solution.

I've got a Hagen/Nutrafin test kit that tests everything but Mg I think. I have a Salifert for Mg, but it's about 4 months from expiring.

Expiration dating can be debatable - 4 months out should be fine!

I don't think it would be necessary to have the water samples all have the same salinity. I do, however think it is absolutely necessary to have a control solution with known concentrations to use to compare the test kits. I think you either have to make control solutions, or just pick one water sample to be a control and establish it's concentration before you start the test comparisons.

Here's my opinion: I think this is interesting and very "doable". We just need to get it together and decide the best way to proceed. I think we should do the following:

Everyone that's interested - figure out what kind of information you want to get out of the testing - what parameters you want to check, etc.

Get a list together of everything we want tested. Get another list together of all the test kits we have available to use. Once we know that, we can figure out what kind of control or multiple controls to use (pre made salt water, calibration fluids etc...), and get them ready. Then we just have to get together and run all the tests. They definitely all need to be done at the same time, under the same lighting conditions, and with a few people that can agree on any questionable results. Putting the data together would be easy, once we have it, we can report it any way we want just using excel.

I have a micro scale at work, it would be easy to make a control after hours, I just don't have all the raw materials. I have access to some of the components, for example we have some calcium that is past our expiration requirements and is going to be disposed of that I could use, but not all of the components! If we could gather up the raw materials though, I could measure them out and make solutions.

You are just nuts! Where do you find this stuff? That's hilarious.....only thing funnier would be to video you talking about your aquarium and songify it.....

It's very possible to make a control, if you have the raw materials. I wasn't thinking of trying to find the best salt, but just thinking in terms of having a control water sample - which the Dallas study didn't have. It's harder to tell if the test kits are truly accurate if you don't have a control solution of known concentrations to test them with. And actually, if you have a good control water sample, you don't need a whole bunch of water samples from different aquariums to find out which test kit is best (since everyone's water is going to be slightly different), you just need a good supply of your control water, and all the test kits that you want to check. You run all of your tests on the same water, and then graph the results from each of the different test kits. That would give you a better idea of which kit is the best.

That's why I was thinking of using salt manufactured for saltwater tanks, they list the mineral concentrations on their packaging, and you wouldn't have to mix up your own components (I don't have calcium and magnesium and iron, or a balance to weigh them out, sitting around). Only problem is you have to trust the manufacturer to list accurate amounts on their packaging, and I don't think they're all that accurate. If you made a control and based on the info on the packaging it said there was 500mg of calcium in a gallon of water, and your test kits say that there is 600mg in a gallon of water, you wouldn't be able to tell if the kits were that inaccurate, or if the info on the packaging was inaccurate.

Another option I just thought of, we could make multiple control samples, one for each component you wanted to test, like pH, or calcium. You could measure out some calcium carbonate and dissolve it in enough water to make the concentration you want, and then use the test kits to check the concentration and compare the results. That way you know the exact concentration and what your result is supposed to be, and can see what kits get the closest result. Not sure how you would make a control for something like nitrates though, would have to think about that one.

This is a Reef Club Forum. Not a singles forum! If you two want to flirt, i can suggest a site or two you can try out.

Well now aren't you the funny one! Wasn't this post supposed to be discussing water test kits??

All right.....when the chubacca (however you spell that) jokes start rolling, I'm out! Back to work....

I already have a room. I'm in it. By myself. Working and bored.

Are you off work today?? Don't you have something better to do than harass me online you electronics dorkus??!!

You hush!!!!

that's a good selling point that ESV has - especially if you really want to control your parameters and get the same results every time you add water to your tank. I would hope though that manufacturers would be fairly consistent, so that once you found a brand you liked and stick with it you'd get consistent enough results to keep your tank happy, corals and inverts are living things that are pretty adaptable for survival, so small fluctuations shouldn't hurt them that badly. It reminds me too of a conversation with one of my friends about using RO water versus purified water for injection for your tank water.

As far as making a control goes, you would probably have to trust that the manufacturer is correct, make your water, calculate what the concentrations of each component are, and then test it with each testing kit you want to evaluate. The only uncertainty then would be assuming that the manufacturer is correct. You could send it to a lab for testing to check the manufacturer specs, but there's always going to be variation, no matter what you do. True statistical evaluation would be pretty time consuming and expensive for a hobby..... Hopefully most of the testing kits would have comparable results so that you could feel pretty good about the accuracy of the manufacturers specs.

I'm starting to ramble....I always get sucked into this kind of stuff....such a science nerd !!

Yeah, all manufacturer's will have variances in their production, but one lot of salt should be consistent for the whole lot, so if they report their results accurately on the bag, then if you make a batch of salt water from that bag, you can calculate the exact concentration of all of the minerals based on your measurements. I just don't know exactly how accurate they will report their results on the package. I don't know much about that manufacturing process for salt, but since it's not a regulated industry, I would imagine that they might not test each lot specifically, they have specs that they're supposed to meet and that's what they publish on the package, and there is going to be some variance from what's on the bag. I'd have to call the mfg and ask if they test for each lot or not, and if they have a certificate of analysis for a particular lot of salt, but it would be interesting to find out!

The other option is to get the individual minerals, chemicals etc. and make up your own batch of water, that way you would know exactly the concentration. You'd have to have a pretty good balance though, and who has that laying around at home??

It wouldn't be that hard to create a control with some freshly made salt water if you're precise with measurements and the manufacturer's listings of chemical concentrations are accurate....I agree that having a control would give more meaning to the accuracy of the results.

I think that's a great idea. They put together a nice report, with some interesting conclusions, especially the magnesium and calcium results. I haven't heard of anyone precipitating calcium before an assay in a long time.

Cool, thanks!

We are a CURRENT sponsor and we have Hagen, some salifert, SeaChem, and what we consider the best kits right now- RedSea.

I have no idea, but it was totally white when we got it, and I've learned that could be bleached? So maybe it wasn't in the greatest shape when we got it?

Yeah, pH papers or test strips and things like that, especially when it's color based and qualitative, are not nearly as accurate. But I've also seen some pretty inaccurate pH meters, even when they're standardized and calibrated.