pabloescolar Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Hey ARC, I'm getting back into the hobby, but this time I'm building out a thoroughly designed rockscape with dry rock. I'm using Marco Rocks to do it, but I feel like $40 for 5 lbs of the Marco Rocks cement seems pretty pricey for some mortar. Anyone have experience using something less expensive that survived years in a tank? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jestep Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 The marco stuff is really good and easier to work with but quickcrete hydraulic cement from lowes or HD is a fraction of the costs and works fine. It sets really fast so work in small quantities. Also, you'll want to cure it underwater for a long time. It messes with PH really badly until fully cured, very alkaline. I believe any portland cement takes in the neighborhood of 30 - 90 days to fully cure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I used Hydraulic Cement and everything I cemented fell apart within a year. FYI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I should note that I used live rock and not dry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabloescolar Posted October 14, 2016 Author Share Posted October 14, 2016 Thanks for the feedback everyone. Jestep, if I let it cure/dry out of water would it take less time to reduce the pH impact? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasReef Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I used Hydraulic Cement and everything I cemented fell apart within a year. FYIDid you use the cement from e marco or a home improvement store? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 I used Hydraulic Cement and everything I cemented fell apart within a year. FYIDid you use the cement from e marco or a home improvement store? For Home Depot Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasReef Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Ok, sorry to hear that. I ordered some e marco and plan on using it soon, I got worried for a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reburn Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Marco rocks mortar = R 400 architectural mortar http://www.cadeco.com/productfiles/0zz_tdg.pdf Acryl 60 http://www.thoroproducts.com/pdf_appl/appl_acryl_60.pdf http://glassbox-design.com/2010/emaco-r-400-archictecural-cement-aquarium-aquascape/ The acryl 60 leeches P04 be prepared to use gfo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasReef Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Marco rocks mortar = R 400 architectural mortar http://www.cadeco.com/productfiles/0zz_tdg.pdf Acryl 60 http://www.thoroproducts.com/pdf_appl/appl_acryl_60.pdf http://glassbox-design.com/2010/emaco-r-400-archictecural-cement-aquarium-aquascape/ The acryl 60 leeches P04 be prepared to use gfo. Thats the first time I am hearing about the p04 from the Acryl 60. My searches have proved fruitless in finding any information. I need to look into it more tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timfish Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Have you thought about drilling your rock? KimP has a video here on drilling. Drilling has the advantage of being able to change it if needed as your corals grow. IMO it's also easier to do arches and bridges than with cement alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chopper65 Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Have you thought about drilling your rock? KimP has a video here on drilling. Drilling has the advantage of being able to change it if needed as your corals grow. IMO it's also easier to do arches and bridges than with cement alone. HaHa loved the video, very informative and at the end was too funny...gig em Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabloescolar Posted October 15, 2016 Author Share Posted October 15, 2016 Reburn: is acryl 60 part of R400? Or does Marco Rocks = R400 and hydraulic cement (Home Depot) = Acryl 60? I'm not stoked on the idea of introducing another maintenance issue to save money if the Marco cement is inherently less impactful. Timfish, I do plan to drill it to have at least two distinct sections I can separate, but the DT is a 24" cube so I'm going to have to heavily contour and customize the structure to get maximum sandbed + maximum coral space + maximum vertical height + pleasing aesthetics. End result will probably share some design in common with this Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reburn Posted October 15, 2016 Share Posted October 15, 2016 Pablo Marco rocks emaco kit = cut up and over priced r400 and acryl 60 The links above is exactly the same as what Marco rocks sells. Hydraulic cement is something different. The r400 is the motar and the acryl 60 is the white liquid that comes in the bottle. I mixed mine 1 part acryl with 0 parts water which is probably why I leeched p04. Reccomend mixing rate is 1/3. It mixes just like mortar for tile. I also used quite a bit of cement for the size of aqua scape. What I did is almost exactly what your wanting to do theory wise. My aqua scape for my 20" cube is two halfs that is platformed up off the sand bed 3" with acylic rods. I used a total of 13 rocks or so. It didn't leech for very long. Maybe a week. It was easy to bring down with gfo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabloescolar Posted October 16, 2016 Author Share Posted October 16, 2016 Thanks for the details Reburn! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltwater snoopy Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Return where did you get the rods just a any home supply or did you have to go to a specific place to get them I need some 3/8 acrylic rod for some live rock i think i want to drill Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reburn Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Do a google search for regal plastics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juiceman Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 I have about 3' of acrylic rod left over from my build you're welcome to. It's from regal plastics Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jestep Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Regal had a crazy minimum purchase amount last time I was in there. I think it went all the way up to $100 minimum and they'll actually turn you away if you don't need that much $ in acrylic. I order from tapplatics on the internet now. Here's their acrylic rod section: http://www.tapplastics.com/product/plastics/plastic_rods_tubes_shapes I believe they'll even cut them down if you don't need super long ones so they're cheaper to ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabloescolar Posted October 16, 2016 Author Share Posted October 16, 2016 I've also read about some people cutting down these fiberglass driveway markers from Home Depot. They're very cheap. Don't know if there are any unintended consequences to using fiberglass though. http://m.homedepot.com/p/The-Hillman-Group-48-in-Driveway-Marker-840074/100146853 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neon Reefer Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Thanks for the feedback everyone. Jestep, if I let it cure/dry out of water would it take less time to reduce the pH impact? No it would not fully cure and pH come down to 7.5 until exposed to water. I just finished building rock columns from Portland, aragonite, crushed coral, salt and fiberglass strips and they cured dry for one week and then wet for four weeks before pH dropped to safe levels. Then of course saltwater cure for the "live affect" Total process was nine weeks and I just placed the first of eight in tank. Has had no effect on pH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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