Noisy Sump Return - Any plumbing pros out there?

[+boognish]

I'm looking for advice on how to quiet down the water returning to my sump. I have a 175 gallon bowfront with dual overflows - one on each end. This is my first tank with dual overflows.

I have 1 1/4" durso standpipes connected to 1" pvc and meet in the middle underneath the tank. From there, it expands to a 1.5" pvc return to the sump. The overflows aren't noisy and the water level in each remains constant without any sucking sounds form water or air. The noise is coming from agitated / aerated water near the end of the 1.5" and bubbles in the water where it enters the sump. I can get it quiet(er) if I dial the return pump down to nearly nothing, but that is not enough flow at all.

Flow diagram/image

Dursos

Sump at return

The current setup I have at the end helped a little, but you can see the amount of air that is coming out. My first thought is to NOT increase the diameter where the two sides of the return meet in the middle. Thoughts?

[mFrame]

First I'd lose the 90 degree elbows in the sump at the return. They cause a drastic change in direction and will create turbulence. I would put a single 45 degree and have it empty into a filter sock about 1" below the water level. That's what I did that enabled me to reduce the noise. Flexible PVC is great to avoid those sharp turns and will increase flow. Shoot an email to our sponsor, FlexPVC.com and I'm sure they can make some additional recommendations.

[+boognish]

Thanks for your reply. That is exactly what I had before this. This isn't glued - just testing a design I saw out there on the innerwebs - so re-working is no issue. The noise/aeration/agitation is orginating in the line, so I'm thinking the solution will be somewhere before the final exit to the sump.

[mFrame]

If you're getting air from the top then it has to do with your intake. I use a hofer gurglebuster on mine which allows me to adjust the water/air ratio and remove the majority of the gurgling. It also gets quieter over time because you'll get a slippery slime of algae on the inside of the pipe so the water will flow smoother.

[Aaarrrggg]

I had the exact same problem on my tank. Grim & I tried a bunch of things to quieter it down. In the end the 3 things that seemed to make the most difference were:

1) 90 degree elbows in the sump.

It seems counterintuitive, but when we added this piece of PVC with two 90 degree elbows to the pipes it was definitely quieter than having the pipes going straight into the sump unhindered.

2) Shower poufs!

I stuffed the top of the chamber with 3 shower poufs. It was originally to help minimise the salt spray, but it usefully seemed to cut down on noise too!

3) Time. Mike is right about the slime build up. Over time the bubbling/noise noticeably diminishes.

[Aaarrrggg]

Oh also! Apparently the grey bendy tubes (like I have in 2nd pic) are better for low noise. I would have thought the opposite was true, but the Internet said otherwise when I was researching.

[Sherita]

I fought this on my 72g. Try using a reverse durso on the outlet end in the sump. It's pretty simple to setup. PM me if you want more info. My drains are now silent, the only thing I hear is the skimmer humming along.

[offroadodge]

Chris i wish you would hvae called, i can help. mine was loud as well. i tried countless ways to quieten it down and now its silent. LMK, i can stop by

[+boognish]

Thanks - Heading up to Lowes now. Reverse durso makes the most sense as a starting point.

[+boognish]

I had enough PVC parts to make the reverse derso and it helped a little. I have ball valves under each overflow. I closed each side about 1/2 way. The added pressure of the reverse durso and closing the ball valves caused each overflow to fill over the top of the dersos. It was completely silent at that point, but flowing pretty well... I think that is essentially the 'herbie' method. Can't leave it that way, but I'm getting closer.

[offroadodge]

its no biggie to have to slow the flow down if u have powerheads in tank. if u dont wanna slow the flow to fill the boxes, then u will have to get a bigger return pump to put more water in the tank faster or raise the 90 degree fitting on durso(longer standpipe). Also on top of your durso i would drill a whole big enough for a 1/4" vinyl hose, it will add oxygen to the water and help the flow.

[FarmerTy]

I'm keeping an eye on this topic. I have the same problem but haven't gotten a chance to sit down and try to address.

I have 2 overflows with durso standpipes, with probably only 1/8 holes drilled on top for air. I run spaflex down to the sump with separate hoses. It's noisy as all get out, with the main noise being gurgling, but only from the longer run of spaflex. The short run is quiet as a mouse.

I understand this as too much flow from my return pump and that I need to dial down the Mag12 and it will flow nice and quiet. Am I understanding this incorrectly?

Alternatively, I could try the reverse durso on the ends of the spaflex in the sump and drill larger air holes (1/2")?

Thanks in advance for any suggestions for the plumbing ignorant.

-Ty

[DerrickH]

Hmm, Ive had all of these problems. My old tank was a homemade durso and I had huge drain line. After all the changing stuff, I just put a large (1" ID) Ball valve on the drain hose and trimmed it a tiny bit and it was silent. Only drawback to "choking" the return that I had, is that my pump GPH drops a bit when the pump is hot. If I shut the pump off and it cools down, when fired back up it seemed that the drains were too slow and tank could possibly overfill. I found a happy medium and all was well. I think the filtersock and 45 is the simplest solution and to get your drain as straight as possible. No "T" fittings, use "Y" fittings. Less turbulence. Its easier to use the barbed "Y" fittings instead of PVC IMO. I wont use hard plumbing any longer, too much of a pain to tear down or if you want to mod things later. I use clear vinyl.

[DerrickH]

I'm keeping an eye on this topic. I have the same problem but haven't gotten a chance to sit down and try to address.

I have 2 overflows with durso standpipes, with probably only 1/8 holes drilled on top for air. I run spaflex down to the sump with separate hoses. It's noisy as all get out, with the main noise being gurgling, but only from the longer run of spaflex. The short run is quiet as a mouse.

I understand this as too much flow from my return pump and that I need to dial down the Mag12 and it will flow nice and quiet. Am I understanding this incorrectly?

Alternatively, I could try the reverse durso on the ends of the spaflex in the sump and drill larger air holes (1/2")?

Thanks in advance for any suggestions for the plumbing ignorant.

-Ty

One thing you could try is put some clear aquarium air tubing in the cap on your durso's. Drill the hole out large enough to force the tubing down through it about 1/3 the way down the stand pipe. This will cause the air "suction" to be forced through the tube instead of gurgling it through the durso inlet elbow. I seen this done on texasnano's tank it works well.

[FarmerTy]

Thanks Derrick. I may try sticking a ball valve and just choking back the drain hose a bit and seeing if that works, like you did. The gurgling is coming from the spaflex itself and not from the durso inlet elbow. It that doesn't work, I'll try ramping down my return pump.

[+brian.srock]

I like to run my return line to the bottom of the tank and have it shoot up then over the bubble wall. This reduces salt spray some and doesn't allow as much detritus to settle on the bottom which I believe addressed some of my PO4 issues.

I have dual 1" returns and utilize a modified durso standpipe due to the footprint I have to work with. I cannot get it 100% quiet but for it being in my media room I cannot hear it unless my ear is near the back of the tank.

[Derek]

Try a U trap in the bottom. I have one in mine and I have been told that I have the quietest tank of all time for its size.

[+boognish]

I have been able to get it about as quiet as can be expected with what seems to be a good flow. I did the following:

• Re-engineered the drain plumbing so that each dump into the sump independently. Before, they joined in the middle and the drain diameter increased. This was causing quite a bit of the turbulence.
  
• Closed the ball valves under each overflow to a bit more than half open which reduced the overflow draining rate. I thought it would affect the water levels in the tank or overflow boxes, but it didn't seem to. just calmed the water and reduced bubbles.
  

Thanks the community and I hope this helps you guys with noisy sumps.

[CBM5]

Chris i wish you would hvae called, i can help. mine was loud as well. i tried countless ways to quieten it down and now its silent. LMK, i can stop by

Off road I am in Cedar Park also and have been trying to reduce my noise and gurgeling as well. The only way I seem to be able to reduce the noise is to cut the return flow way down. Any recomentations? Chris M.

[offroadodge]

send me a pic or maybe i can stop by. Just got back in town from a week of Mercedes training in Houston.